Dawn of War 2

sup people.

This game is stall very stall atm. Its hard dealing with alot of things, and there are no valid crowd control tools in the tier1 phase, of the game. ( this mostly applies to eldar and SM)

Mostly the reason suppresion is so easy to deal with, is that they dont do there job.. Since almost every hero have a form to counter them from the get go, and most jumptroops comes out very early and counter them extremly easly.(JUMPTROOPS will not be usless they would still be the unit that can close in on the suppression team fastest of any type of troops.


In short I am trying to promote, that this community can have a little disscussion about how we fix em.

I would mostly like to give both shuriken and devistator squad, a 5 - 10 range increase, and then decrease jump/teleport troops, with around 2 - 5. So there is no way, what so ever, that you can attack a Suppression platform from the front. ofc, they would need a slight decrease in there cone/arc of fire, and Damage, they should suppress. As well as a small detection range.

Suppression platforms are there to force The enemy to spread there forces. THis would make the swarm armies, namly orks and nids, two very intresting faction, and as well alot harder and master, than just blobing up a huge army of shootaz/tG, that tthe current metagame consist of.

as far as eldar and sm go, they would be to also difficult armies to master, to full effect. since you as well would be very reliant on utilization the suppression platform, to stop the your enemies to over run you, and also have good skill at scouting a head of your set up team. this will also open, for some new BO, and wider array of heroes would be (more) viable.

so I guesse you can start flamming me now

This post has been edited by Teigen: Jan 29 2010, 12:15 PM

I don't think the SP needs an extension on range. It already has a massive cone of fire, especially in comparison to the HBD.

I can't really answer your question, but I just wanted you to know that. Check out the differences of the two. HBD sucks.

i sort of agree with your idea. but suppression teams need to be powerful, long range, wide area suppressors, not narrow cone shooters.

make them the ultra powerful ranged units they are meant to be, but at the cost of speed, melee defence and having to set up. basically what they are now......just buff em. maybe add some uniqueness to each races suppression team and voila

Guided Shuriken platform....mmmmm...

Could you atleast add something to tjue disscusion,, like
The two beforeyou.

Nabo@ i an not just talking about the shuriken. I am refering to norheim factions. Sm and eldar.

Please look at from å bigger perspektiv.this is to help sm ånd eldar. As well as balancing, the currentx tier1 tier 1.5 of the game

eh, i thought i did, it had a 2nd line below. my mistake, sorry.

it went something like, shuriken platforms getting increased arc of fire when guided.

This post has been edited by Dirkradix: Jan 29 2010, 15:38 PM

Teigen, as you opened a thread to inform us that you are back, I would like to suggest you to get familiar with the game again first.


I don't feel that the game is stall and I think sup-teams do their job well, you just don't need them in all matchups. That's the crux of the matter, at least as I see it.

you also have to consider what unit-combinations you have to use for the supporting of the sup-teams actually. You really have to think how to place your squads and which squads you need. You need to learn again which combinations are solid and which are not.

IMHO, relic did a good job with the T1,5 units. So I can't really critize it.

what do you mean with 'crowd control tools' ?

This post has been edited by Harry Russ: Jan 29 2010, 15:41 PM

I don't quite understand the problem you are describing - I find the shuriken and HBD do their job just fine - making them impossible to counter from the front or buffing their damage more could easily be too much. As eldar, you should have banshees around to protect the shuri from being jumped on. Two devs or two shuris covering each other has been shown to be a very viable tactic as well. It's just about positioning them and keeping them moving and having them not be where your enemy expects. Eldar and SM both have their crowd control methods and against equal opponents they work pretty well.

Wow, it's like time-loop.. or like Teigen's never been away/banned/etc. He left being angry at suppresion teams, he is back angry at suppresion teams. 6 (5? 7? 12?) months just dissapeared!

And hmm.. I know you've just returned from grave, but perhaps you already noticed that there is a _massive_ patch coming up along with CR in like a 1.5 month. Best idea would be propably to actually see _what_ it brings, then learn to use changed units (if there are changes) and then perhaps discuss neccesary changes.

Crowd control means anti Blobing tools

first. yes I still use the shuriken cannon and Devistator squad(this one suck for many resons)

and its great. But its to easly countered(to easlely). if the shuriken got a range increase. and damage reduction. it would encourage, more tacitcs, and good troop maneuver by your opponent.`to Outsmart you, instead of blobing shit, then teleport hero in tie up shuriken/devestator(fleshook) and then just blob you to death.


cicho-sza@ I got back to the game just because of that

harry russ@ we have played... and well. I didn't....>.>. your harry russ 2 rite=?

edit@ me being moron

edit2@ okay, and I will calm down now, we dont want me banned again, do we :b. well I am oppen to listen to more intresting proposals

I would like comments. like Why you might not think they need a buff and the like

This post has been edited by Teigen: Jan 29 2010, 16:08 PM

I look forward for a rematch then, just add me (Harry Russ 2): Oh, even I can lose a game - I really have no problem with it - but what does this ' add to the discussion ' as you mentioned earlier?

stellvia does not not play anymore.

to blobbing tools, I think it actually works with the current suppteams, tho Nids have the best anti-blob tools with toxic sacs or BSWB.

Orcs sup-team has a bit low-range I admit, tho giving them a more powerful one could hurt balance enormously.



hihi, ah ok. right. yeah, nonetheless just add me if you like.


Tho, I think sup teams have more range wouldn't be so bad, because it would cause your opp to think deepter, but otherwise, the game could become very static. So the game would be even more about VP camp, more range would favor camping... so I really don't know, I just like it how it is actually.

This post has been edited by Harry Russ: Jan 29 2010, 16:19 PM

yes I Think your rather beastly at microing. much more than me :

Ork and nids are the supposed Swarm faction, Nids the most. aka The flanking faction.

eldar and Sm, is the more defensive ones, Sm the most defensive ones atm. There Devistator is really bad. in manny scnenarios, and vs some heroes.

am not asking for much. but they are Support team, they are supposed to suppoert! :b. 5 range increase would fix wounders vs, alot of the biggest problems atm.

teigen you have to active an option that you can receive PM actually, can't answer your PM ^^

I actually agreeded with Teigen's suggestion from way back. I've always had the same feelings myself of suppression teams, coming from a COH background.

An increase in suppression team range with a decrease in arc of fire and a decrease in jump troop jump range would be great for this game, IMO. It would reduce blobbing quite a bit. Relic, however doesn't seem to want to make this game too much like COH.

This isn't really balance related as it is to fundamental game design. Balance-wise, SP are obviously awesome right now while HBD are complete crap.

This post has been edited by link0: Jan 29 2010, 21:39 PM

I'd like to say I agree with what link0 said. If nothing else it would be a really interesting experiment.

Thanks , and yes the current shuirken is a ton better than the other suppression teams.

I dont think the fundamental game design, would be that much changed, the problem really is with new players. or Troll type of people that dont know how to get around suppresion teams.

its a reall shame, that they dont want good working crowd control weapon in tier1. tbh It would make sm, a bit hard to get really really good with. But they would be very fun to play. and every unit would have a purpose. and you would get back the feeiling Super troppers.

How awesome wouldn't it not be to fend of 8x4 hg, 32 gaunts. with a tsm a scout hero and a dev.

thats like 10 guys, vs 32small guys and a hero. That would seriously. make me want to play nids, again.

remeber good folks. I orginaly bought this game since nids reminded me of US(COH) but just that creepy swarmy furry, tingly feeling, when I succesfully outmanovred my opponents 2xshuriken, hero and 2xguardians, with my 4xhG and my hero.

when from nowhere the swarm comes leaping at you from every direction.

lol sorry for the story :b

edit@ grrr nids are so furry, and kawaiiiiii~

This post has been edited by Teigen: Jan 30 2010, 00:14 AM

Anyone agree that heroes should not naturally be able to counter suppression teams?

I see your point, not sure I'm onboard with your 2nd day back suggestion... The balance isn't that bad for supression units, they're def still worth getting and not OP at this point. There may be a lot of other problems with extending range and reducing jump range. Such as jumping for other reasons may be come useless because distance is too low, Supression units become drop and forget till Teir 2+ while you hold ground till much later game.

At least you're making the forum more active, they've been dead lately.

Having a narrower arc makes teams much more vulnerable to flanks. They are also still very vulnerable to jump troops (jump flank would be really easy) and cloaked units.

It would just prevent people from blobbing 100% of their army together. When they hit suppression team resistance, they just 1-click their jump troop to nullify it. Really lame game mechanic.

This post has been edited by link0: Jan 30 2010, 03:12 AM

first of all, welcome back Teigen

to the topic


I agree with you that its hard to use suppression but the problem is the ability to instantly flank these suppressions teams are not penalized enough in cost.In addition, heroes and jump troops come to the battle field already equipped with an ability to counter suppression.For example, jump troops could have shorter range for the jump and upgraded later for a longer jump(I am not sure, does the ork jump troops have this upgrade?).

Now for the suppression teams arc of fire and damage I don't see any reason why should we change that;the suppression team does a great job at suppressing units and ' ok damage'.
we don't want a unit that do it all or everybody will just start spamming them.