Alrighty so ima pretty much sum up most build orders i used in the KOTH tournament and explain in detail how i used them aswell as my power distrobution.
Game 6 Maintee vs Me
Alright so this game is pretty straight forward. I use the Surveilance sweep straight away to see if there is alot of barracks cores coming out. If there are i build double barracks queue 10 peacekeepers and 89 javelin soliders from one rax and 99 from the other. Once i got around 5 peacekeepers i send em straight to his base and start killing everything. This stratergy is very risky and if youre giving rematches etc you should NOT use this buildorder. That is if youve used it in the first game. Good players will know how to counter it and it gets easier if expect it.
What Maintee did was a good reaction but it still was a bit little too late So i had that game in the bag.
Here i use my standard bo vs allied players. Although in this game i was kind of sucking so. Make sure you send dogs to both derricks. Try sending them on the ridges since it gives u more sight and dodge the enemies peacekeepers and aim for the engies. You always cap the oil with a engi ifv. And once youve got the wf up build a pp and then a ref then tech to t2 This will ensure you a strong economy. Also if you want you may also want to garrison the huts near your harvesters on Temple Prime. That might save you from javelin annoyance. From there spam guardians untill you have a decent force. Then you move your mcv to the side meanwhile you can either A build javelins and peacekeepers to assist or just save money. Make sure you deploy the mcv as close to the ridge as possible so that you can build a rax on the top level. This is key. So right after you deployed your mcv get a ref going and deploy it and then go for a rax on the top. Build some javs and see if your opponent has built a ref on his ridge, If so lazer lock it with your javs and it will die quickly. Then garrisond the middle building its great AA and vision. From there you adapt.
BO: RAX (4 dogs 2 to each spike) -> PP -> REF -> WF -> PP -> REF -> T2 -> Get tanks -> Move mcv -> Ref -> RAX
This game i tried this bo out for the 2nd time and it worked pretty darn well vs empire. This is a nice alternative to manspam if you want to hit your enemy early and hard. You start off with a powerplant proceeed with a refinery and later on a wf. From there queue 4 ifvs and start building a rax. Queue 4 peacekeepers from the rax garrisond the ifvs with them. send 3 ifvs out as soon as u got em and let the 4th come in a bit late. Now this is key if he attacks you with tengus kill em, although if he runs off to the wf dont follow. go on the harvesters. ALWAYS then i mean ALWAYS fight near the refinery. Never fight near a wf. Once you got ur 2nd ref up tech to t2 and proceed with guardians and adapt really.
You start off with a powerplant proceeed with a refinery and later on a wf. From there queue 4 ifvs and start building a rax. Queue 4 peacekeepers from the rax garrisond the ifvs with them. send 3 ifvs out as soon as u got em and let the 4th come in a bit late. Now this is key if he attacks you with tengus kill em
Could you elaborate on this please? I understand that fighting around the enemy warfac is bad because he gets repairs, but about peacekeeper IFVs, do I leave the peacekeepers in the IFVs when they get to the enemy base or have them exit? Also, should I be mixing Javelin IFVs in the mix, or just go straight out peacekeeper for all four IFVs? Thanks.
Btw, you're still king of the hill, right? Nice playing!
This post has been edited by Windows V: Aug 29 2008, 00:24 AM
Could you elaborate on this please? I understand that fighting around the enemy warfac is bad because he gets repairs, but about peacekeeper IFVs, do I leave the peacekeepers in the IFVs when they get to the enemy base or have them exit? Also, should I be mixing Javelin IFVs in the mix, or just go straight out peacekeeper for all four IFVs? Thanks.
Btw, you're still king of the hill, right? Nice playing!
Leave the peacekeepers in the IFVs, they do incredible damage against all tier1 light armor and of course infantry as well. They also tear up harvesters. Also, this is a PK IFV rush build; build all 4 of your infantry PKs. PK IFVs do more damage against light armor and also pick off infantry.
The only time you should be exiting the PKs out of your IFVs is if one of the three things happens:
1. You are attacking a building. PK IFVs do barely any damage to buildings, and if you evacuate them, the empty IFVs will shoot rockets.
2. Your opponents Tengus switch to jet form, in which case exiting the IFVs will allow the empty IFVs to fire AA rockets at the airborne tengus. Same situation if he has any air unit attacking your IFVs.
3. Your IFV is about to die, in which case you should evacuate your PK such that you do not lose both the IFV and the PK.
What if the map was Cabana Republic, where it's quite easier to get an oil derrick? Should I build a barracks, engineer, and dog, then go PP -> REF -> WF etc?
Also, should the fourth IFV be an Engy IFV to capture something / repair the first three peacekeeper IFVs in case he builds tank busters?
This post has been edited by Windows V: Aug 29 2008, 23:48 PM
Another question regarding the peacekeeper strategy: You posted this build order for it - What if the map was Cabana Republic, where it's quite easier to get an oil derrick? Should I build a barracks, engineer, and dog, then go PP -> REF -> WF etc?
Also, should the fourth IFV be an Engy IFV to capture something / repair the first three peacekeeper IFVs in case he builds tank busters?
The main point of that build is to get PK IFVs out more quickly then you would in a normal game where you would fight for the oil in the beginning. You can always go for dogs and an early engy for the oil if you'd like, I personally always do myself, but for this particular build you skip it to get a quick rush of PK IFVs.
Once again, this is a 4 PK IFV rush build so all four should be PKs, however, if you notice from scouting that your opponent has weak defenses or a weak threat against you, you can definitely mix in an engy IFV to cap a building. However, the statement you made about tankbusters will never be a problem, PK IFVs are the counter to infantry and they absolutely tear through tankbusters. You will not need a repair IFV for that reason.
This is just one of the many builds listed meaning this is not THE build for the allies as there should never be just one single build, but rather this is just a build you can use depending on what you believe your opponent is going to do. Your build should depend on the opponent you're playing, his faction, and highly dependent on your scouting.
Because: Vs. Empire on Cabana -> doh, get derrick.
Vs. Allies on both maps > Get 3 pk, then engi > you can make sure your engi get's that derrick with the cover of PKs and you can put PKs in IFVs when you get them - they are not wasted.
Only vs sovs would I think twice about going pp before rax.
It's understandable that an Empire player would opt for power first, since the core build times are so short, it would only delay the rax by a few seconds.
But for Allies and Soviets, there is ZERO point to going power before rax if you have any intention of making a rax before war.
Whether you go power -> rax or rax -> power, the delay to your refinery (and thus factory) is going to be the same. So unless you don't plan on going rax at all, there's no reason why it shouldn't be the first building you make.
Practice, please use the replay BBcode to embed the replays.
But for Allies and Soviets, there is ZERO point to going power before rax if you have any intention of making a rax before war.
Well, nitpicking of course, but if you go pp > ref > rax you will actually have a harverster load earlier. Vs sovs I would never go rax first because of bears (I'd go vindicators first vs sovs anyhow...).
Ok, I compared my build orders to yours and they are exactly the same
Although I would note that I try not to build too many infantry with the manspam, so I can move the water and have a headstart on the empire in that department.
Well, the problem with this is, YOU'RE the one who is wasting the cash once they build frogs
You can't really recover from an air build and suddenly send IFVs at them. Though I guess infantry spam might work. Yeah, you'll have a harvester load earlier, but your scouting (and possible oil denial) will be prevented.
You're in a good position if you get two vindicators. It doesn't brake your eco and you can deny derricks, and pick out units. You also don't have to fear TDs early on. Anyway, don't want to hijack this topic. I made a thread about vindicators vs sovs here: http://www.gamereplays.org/community/index...howtopic=403211 - so far I have a 100% success rate using it vs sovs. Including supposedly good sov players.
Are you kidding me? Denying sovs from any derricks and forcing them to waste initial cash on bullfrogs is no good? Lol.
Oh yeah and those vindicators are FUCKIN NASTY they kill like 1 harv in two runs with 4 of em. theyre a fuckin joke tbh. much much better off going tanks
oh and denying oil is made better and easier with dogs and micro
This post has been edited by Pr4ct1c3: Sep 2 2008, 17:19 PM
Oh yeah and those vindicators are FUCKIN NASTY they kill like 1 harv in two runs with 4 of em. theyre a fuckin joke tbh. much much better off going tanks
oh and denying oil is made better and easier with dogs and micro
Lol...who would go after harvesters with vindicators read what I write...
read what I write...
Game 6 Maintee vs Me
Alright so this game is pretty straight forward. I use the Surveilance sweep straight away to see if there is alot of barracks cores coming out. If there are i build double barracks queue 10 peacekeepers and 89 javelin soliders from one rax and 99 from the other. Once i got around 5 peacekeepers i send em straight to his base and start killing everything. This stratergy is very risky and if youre giving rematches etc you should NOT use this buildorder. That is if youve used it in the first game. Good players will know how to counter it and it gets easier if expect it.
What Maintee did was a good reaction but it still was a bit little too late So i had that game in the bag.
BO: RAX (10 pk 89 jav)-> RAX(99 JAV) -> PP -> REF -> REF -> Adapt
REPLAY LINK
Game 7 AlbertAlar vs Me
He basically just plainly lost once he saw the inf lol.
BO: RAX (10 pk 89 jav)-> RAX(99 JAV) -> PP -> REF -> REF -> Adapt
REPLAY LINK
Game 8 ChicagoHawk vs Me
Here i use my standard bo vs allied players. Although in this game i was kind of sucking so. Make sure you send dogs to both derricks. Try sending them on the ridges since it gives u more sight and dodge the enemies peacekeepers and aim for the engies. You always cap the oil with a engi ifv. And once youve got the wf up build a pp and then a ref then tech to t2 This will ensure you a strong economy. Also if you want you may also want to garrison the huts near your harvesters on Temple Prime. That might save you from javelin annoyance. From there spam guardians untill you have a decent force. Then you move your mcv to the side meanwhile you can either A build javelins and peacekeepers to assist or just save money. Make sure you deploy the mcv as close to the ridge as possible so that you can build a rax on the top level. This is key. So right after you deployed your mcv get a ref going and deploy it and then go for a rax on the top. Build some javs and see if your opponent has built a ref on his ridge, If so lazer lock it with your javs and it will die quickly. Then garrisond the middle building its great AA and vision. From there you adapt.
BO: RAX (4 dogs 2 to each spike) -> PP -> REF -> WF -> PP -> REF -> T2 -> Get tanks -> Move mcv -> Ref -> RAX
REPLAY LINK
Game 10 Ithildur vs Me
This game i tried this bo out for the 2nd time and it worked pretty darn well vs empire. This is a nice alternative to manspam if you want to hit your enemy early and hard. You start off with a powerplant proceeed with a refinery and later on a wf. From there queue 4 ifvs and start building a rax. Queue 4 peacekeepers from the rax garrisond the ifvs with them. send 3 ifvs out as soon as u got em and let the 4th come in a bit late. Now this is key if he attacks you with tengus kill em, although if he runs off to the wf dont follow. go on the harvesters. ALWAYS then i mean ALWAYS fight near the refinery. Never fight near a wf. Once you got ur 2nd ref up tech to t2 and proceed with guardians and adapt really.
BO: PP -> REF -> WF -> RAX -> PP -> REF -> t2 -> Adapt
REPLAY LINK
And oh support power distrubution is always survelience sweep -> chrono rift -> adapt
Any sort of feed back is greatly appriciated and post your questions here aswell!
This post has been edited by Pr4ct1c3: Aug 28 2008, 21:54 PM
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