Avoid auto-attacking eh? Here I was, trying to push as early as possible. No wonder that never really worked.
There's a pretty famous topic on dota allstars.com that goes on for like 50+ pages because some guy said it was better to auto-attack because you pushed lanes faster.
I think he is possibly one of the greatest trolls of all time.
Can't really blame me/us. It's only logical to think: helping creeps = creeps surviving = early pressure + possible early tower gank. When in reality, the early goons are nothing and die like flies to towers. If there's an enemy hero near that tower they'll just rank up for free and get access to higher levels earlier. Am I correct?
There's a pretty famous topic on dota allstars.com that goes on for like 50+ pages because some guy said it was better to auto-attack because you pushed lanes faster.
I think he is possibly one of the greatest trolls of all time.
Can't really blame me/us. It's only logical to think: helping creeps = creeps surviving = early pressure + possible early tower gank. When in reality, the early goons are nothing and die like flies to towers. If there's an enemy hero near that tower they'll just rank up for free and get access to higher levels earlier. Am I correct?
As with a lot of things - sometimes
It's situational. For example; if you're on legion bottom lane with pyromancer/behemoth you're better off pushing the lane up a bit, you both have aoe damage abilities that you can use to farm and harass at the same time (behemoth not so much because of the low mana pool but you get the idea), this both pushes the lane and hurts the enemy heroes. This reduces the chances they'll try and initiate on you (they might die if you just turn around and hit them), reduces their ability to get near the creep wave (same problem) and allows Behemoth to head back and creep pull the neutrals into the lane.
This means you get neutrals killing some of your creeps (better than a deny because the enemy heroes get absolutely zero exp), gives your lane more overall experience (more enemy mobs are dying near your heroes) and extra gold (last hit the neutrals). Without pushing the lane, this is a really bad idea because it will result in the enemy heroes being able to gank the creep-puller, who is alone and out of position, tower-dive using the creeps to tank and hit the guy alone on the lane or simply start taking down the tower very quickly. It's also good because it pulls your lane back and their next creep wave will be really close to your tower- possibly under it, this leaves them either open to ganks or no-where near the creeps and losing out on gold and exp. Plus you get the remaining creeps coming out of the jungle and creating a 1.5-2 wave push that can let you seriously harass their tower without significant danger on the lane (it's tough for low level heroes to kill you if they're going to get 6+ creeps hitting them too).
There are also times when your team is going for heavy pushing (pollywog, defiler etc.) in which case you want to push the lane up a bit to get the tower down to lower life so you can finish it with your ult at lvl 6, taking towers early is great for your team and bad for their team, but with a single creep wave at a time you need a hero that can directly support the push and put serious damage in to the tower.
QUOTE
If there's an enemy hero near that tower they'll just rank up for free and get access to higher levels earlier.
This isn't really true, the enemy heroes will be on the lane anyway. Being nearer the tower makes it harder for both you and them to last hit, but more so for you since you cannot seriously threaten an enemy hero under their tower most of the time. The exp they get will not be affected by where on the lane the creeps are dying so they'll level up at the same rate whatever.
So in the end, it all comes down to learning what your opponent is doing, and responding to it.
The depth in this game is overwhelming at times. But who am I to say, I'm C&C exclusive for the past 5 years, save from BFME2. And I like it. Gives me something to think about. In any case, it's better than brainless shooter #343897.
I might be a noob for doing so, but I try to push the first tower of each lane as fast as possible (unless I'm a hero that is not capable of pushing ofc), because that makes ganking and chasing so mcuh easier when the first tower is down of a lane.
Sure, it makes you vunerable to ganks while you're pushing, but once those first towers are down, the enemy is very susceptible to ganks if they cross the river because the way to safety is a much longer one now.
First, nuke / harass the enemy hero. Once he goes to heal, push as fast as possible. As long as an enemy hero is in the lane, getting that tower down is almost impossible.
However, if he leaves his lane for 30 secs, you can get the tower to half health or even better.
A good but risky tactic is to let 1 player push the tower, the other one (possibly one with fleeing skills / high MS, because the enemies WILL come hunt you down) intercepts the enemy creep wave before they reach their tower, so my creeps do not focus on them but get the tower down.
Of course, all of this is only viable in PUB games, I doubt it would work in a pr0+++ game.
This post has been edited by Scetch: Aug 28 2009, 22:13 PM
Suggesting tips based on the inferior quality of your opponents isn't really helpful. In a game with a good team they'll defend their towers when they get low to ensure the deny and gank you easily if you push the lane constantly. Not to mention that you'll be making farming and preventing ganks easier for your opponent.
Pushing is obviously the way to eventually win but it isn't a good idea to push the lanes early on when you're trying to farm and is generally something which should be co-ordinated in advance with your team/battle plan and wards in the correct positions.
I actually recall an article about a pro dota team who popularized the strategy of taking the two outer towers (top/bot) fast for map control. It does make the basic rune ward obsolete since you effectively open up a couple more ganking lanes, ones that dont go right through the rune spots. It forces them to spend more time/money on warding, or more often than not, get ganked through routes not often used early game.
Not to mention, 400 gold per person on your team, not counting who actually last hits the tower, is a large boost ahead, and if your ward whore is any good, will probably use the bonus gold to counterward the existing rune wards, virtually making all of their lanes un-farmable. Complete map control
This, of course, requires more than just blind luck and more than just pushing the two outside towers down, you've gont to know how to use the situation to maximum effect.
Yes there was also the popular 6.52e strategy of using Axe/Warlock combination to cut the lane and thus take the first outer-tower down in the first 5minutes but that exploited the nature of the meta-game and the fact that a weak laning carry would be with a babysit and thus not able to kill the lane cutters etc. As a general rule and for people starting out that is all a little bit complicated.
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