Red Alert 3

There is a patch (or a mod whatever) that has generated a lot of talk on the official forums. Would there be any interest in having a tournament on it? Here is the change log I'll provide a download link as soon as I can find a working link.

This would be a just for fun thing to see how it plays. If there is no interest we won't bother, if there is some why not? Feedback please.

Change list:

Global
All base defenses take 50% damage from gun damage types from 100%

Allied
Price of dog decreased to 150 from 200
Aircraft now start with the additional ammunition provided by advanced aeronuatics
Advanced aeronautics now provides the health and vision bonuses only
Allied power plant now provides 125 power from 100
Outpost deploy time now 20 seconds from 30
Defence bureau now requires 50 power from 75
Cryocopters now freeze collectors 40% slower
Dolphins sonar weapons range increased to 140 from 100 and can target submerged units
Mirage tank cloak bubble is no longer visable
Prism tower max stack damage changed from 2 to 5, and buffed stack damage (2 towers will now do the same damage linked as when they were seperate, not less)
Javelin IFV and Multigunner Javelin reload time reduced to 2 from 4
Spy IFV range increased 250 from 200
Aircraft carrier drone health decreased 25%


Soviet
MCV speed decreased to 35 from 50
Build time of conscript and bear swapped
Sickle cost decreased to 800 from 900
Flak trooper: Cost decreased to 300, mines now do 50% damage from 75%
Apocalypse tank cannons damage increased from 100 to 130
Molotov reload speed increased, flight speed increased 150 to 190
Natasha's pilot snipe reload speed reduced to 40 seconds from 60
Natasha bombing run arive time reduced from 5 to 3
Tesla coils can now be charged up by 3 tesla troopers from 1
Sputnik cost reduced to 1000
Kirov Speed increased 40 to 50, afterburner speed increased 55 to 65

Empire
MCV speed increased to 50 from 40
Price of tengu increased 850 from 800
Price of imperial warrior increased 200 from 150
Damage of final squadron increased
Balloon bomb damage increased to 200 from 150
Defender core available after power plant
Shinobis no longer cause "enemy infiltrator detected"
Shinobis should use their shurikens until enemy forces come within sword range
King oni health decreased to 2600 from 3000
Honourable Discharge nerfed for all units except the burst drone
Added Archer maiden AA infantry
Sea Wing rise speed increased from 1.5 to 2.5

Misc
Allowed more colours in MP/Skirmish
Added unit crates (more will come later on, with new/unused units ^^)
Javelin soldier now wears armour instead of a vest

Download

You know what? I don't agree with certain changes, but let's have a tourney. Anything that could even cause minor interest is good enough at this point.

I'd support whalegamer on that one. Hopefully it creates enough interest. Thx meth for digging this out

This post has been edited by doesn't matter: Oct 14 2010, 06:20 AM

It would help to provide a link
http://forums.commandandconquer.com/jforum...list/43998.page
By the way, it isn't finished yet...

(also the RA3 section on the C&C forums are kinda stuffed up atm)

This post has been edited by M4dn3ss: Oct 14 2010, 07:51 AM

Price of dog decreased to 150 from 200 ------ agreed though not happy with it
Aircraft now start with the additional ammunition provided by advanced aeronuatics ---- not sure personllaly i dont like it.
Advanced aeronautics now provides the health and vision bonuses only ------ agreed
Allied power plant now provides 125 power from 100 ----Can't agree with it
Outpost deploy time now 20 seconds from 30 -- agreed
Defence bureau now requires 50 power from 75 -- agreed, maybe it will be used sometimes than
Cryocopters now freeze collectors 40% slower --- agreed!!! And the shrink beam needs a nerf, so that the unit becomes big again before the cryo shrinks a second one.
Dolphins sonar weapons range increased to 140 from 100 and can target submerged units --- i agree with the first part not with the second one.
Mirage tank cloak bubble is no longer visable --- agreed
Prism tower max stack damage changed from 2 to 5, and buffed stack damage (2 towers will now do the same damage linked as when they were seperate, not less)--- agreed
Javelin IFV and Multigunner Javelin reload time reduced to 2 from 4 ---- agreed
Spy IFV range increased 250 from 200 --- no thats kinda too much for a thing that is already close to op
Aircraft carrier drone health decreased 25% -- agreed but not sure wheather its helpfull


Soviet
MCV speed decreased to 35 from 50 --- No? Why making the sovs weak at expanding?
Build time of conscript and bear swapped --- mhh if bear is on 3 sek agreed if not i have my problems with it.
Sickle cost decreased to 800 from 900 ---- sickle costs more than tengu? not a too good idea.
Flak trooper: Cost decreased to 300, mines now do 50% damage from 75%-- agreed with price mhh mines.... well ok
Apocalypse tank cannons damage increased from 100 to 130 --- agreed but it wont help at all
Molotov reload speed increased, flight speed increased 150 to 190 -- it should be the other way around if you ask me
Natasha's pilot snipe reload speed reduced to 40 seconds from 60 -- agreed
Natasha bombing run arive time reduced from 5 to 3 ---- ow yea wake up goddamn pilot
Tesla coils can now be charged up by 3 tesla troopers from 1 ---- sensefull? well agreed( also by 3 stingrays than)
Sputnik cost reduced to 1000 --- agreed sputnik ftw! (maybe also buikld time reduce)
Kirov Speed increased 40 to 50, afterburner speed increased 55 to 65--- agreed!
maybe also something to buff v4, something like raising the attackspeed, or.. at least to hit two out of 5 times without microing like a mad.

Empire
MCV speed increased to 50 from 40. no? empire is good enough at expanding with their cores. so dont give them a soviet mcv.
Price of tengu increased 850 from 800 --- i guess this one will kill empire tenguspamm, well and make empire t1 very week vs sov t1 as soviets can spamm empire to death with sickles
Price of imperial warrior increased 200 from 150 ---- only if you raise PK price to 250, otherwise IW=175$
Damage of final squadron increased --- agreed
Balloon bomb damage increased to 200 from 150 --- agreed
Defender core available after power plant
Shinobis no longer cause "enemy infiltrator detected" --- no, sinobis are already good enough
Shinobis should use their shurikens until enemy forces come within sword range -- yea ofc ... 2 shinobis own 20 bears, and shinobi in the house ftw. slaughtering 50 conscripts or 40 iws.
King oni health decreased to 2600 from 3000 --- agreed will make it weaker against allies will hardly change something against sovs
Honourable Discharge nerfed for all units except the burst drone,- agreed, make it stronger for burst drone, (burst drone ftw!)
Added Archer maiden AA infantry --- ehm no? emp inf is already strong enough as it is? i mean look at tank busters? the only thing that makes them not op is that empire lacks in AA inf, if you give empire AA ing make tank buster cost 350$+
Sea Wing rise speed increased from 1.5 to 2.5 - i dont care at all sky wing is OP anyways
would be nice to make striker vx faster on ground move and a bit weaker vs buildings if in chopper mode.
also nerfing waveforce artellerie would be very good, i mean 3 waveforce artelleries need to charge up 25% and bye heroic apo tank. This thing totaly throws out sovs at tier 3 vs empire

Misc
Allowed more colours in MP/Skirmish--- yea pink ftw!
Added unit crates (more will come later on, with new/unused units ^^)
Javelin soldier now wears armour instead of a vest

well those are my opinions, you dont have to share them but i wanted to say them

Srsly. RA3 is ALMOST balanced.
That are -like usual- too many changes.
Finally I know where EA got their stupid Balancechanges from. =(

Why just no copy & past the things what the RA3 Experts did?

Anyway, I will 'counter' a couple "balance- changes"

This is so pointless, it's defently made by a Sovietplayer, this would make the Conscriptspam sooooo damn difficult to stop.

This is such a pointless change like the change from above, it would make Cryoopenings so damn useless.
Nothing that all races can counter them so easy, no, let's make this unit complete useless, yay!

Made by a Sovhater I guess, a guy who lost because he got crushed.
This would take the changes of the Soviets against Empire, fine, it is good against Allies but a Cryo and it's 'over'.
A MCV is just a huge Metalshield Allies can shrink or Emp can easily destroy with a couple VX.

Well, it enough, the whole list is a joke, there's only one point I agree with:




The 'real-patch' 1.13:



This post has been edited by zokker13: Oct 14 2010, 09:07 AM

I think that cryos need a nerf vs harvesters. as a cryo frozes a harvester faster than 3 twins kill it also a cryo is almost undistructable witth groudn AA espacially with flaktroopers

People... please take notice to when it stand decrease or increase!

Xas1 - the sickle price is decreasing so no it will not cost more then a tengu (but it does with the patch we have now)

Zokker - How on earth will conscript spams becomes stronger when the dog gets cheaper?

I don't want to get into a debate about the individual changes. What I want to know is

1. Would you play?
2. Or not?

If we do this and have some direct experience with the patch/mod and want to talk about the good and the bad of it fine. But at this point all I want to know is.....if we organize this will you play?

My logic here is totally what whalegamer has already identified. Things are quiet, this should be fun, so why not? But that is just me I don't really matter. What matter is you and whether you'll show up.



I disagree. This conversation is simply about whether to host a tournament or not. All the rest of it, including all 16 pages of that thread, is nothing more than a distraction. If we do this, and some people want to join the discussion changes, then that becomes germane.

Yes, I would play that tourney if I free on the day it take place

well im a soveit player and unlike the other players i agree with the changes looks nice the allies dotn look good same with the empire but this is a great opertunity for me to do some damage with my new strats, great work Meth ill play in the tournament if you promiss me that me and jonnyknows can cast after=)
CABAL^

That is all I can ask thanks!



I would love for you guys to cast a few of the matches that would be great!

there's a problem with team colors

the new green & red & yellow are like the default colors

i played Skirmish and my enemy have a color similar to my color

I would like to play it though i think that i as soviet will die if empire reaches t3 xD

I agree with almost all the changes, except the second part of the dolphin thing... the dolphin is just too fast to allow such a thing.
Even that I never play any official tourney, I will play in this one.

waaaah, what you tAlking about guys?

Providing I have nothing on at the time, sure

Do have an approximate date set or is it all still up in the air at the moment?

I might (50:50) download, but only for this tourney.

Honestly, read and please. Just accept it ok.

List is made by someone who is not a top player.

the fact that top players did not make these massive lists, etr, is enough to show that these are all pointless and wrong.

The only things I think needing a nerf, Tengu, VX and tsunami cooldowns increased by maybe like 8 or 9 seconds. Maybe, just maybe, IW cost $200. Allies is strong but so easily flanked that complaints about units are not worth listening to. Soviets have the strongest units in game, but only do one function, eg nothing has dual ability, but its the best at what it does. this build radius + crane complaints are stupid. Empire is most flexible, but it comes at a cost. I just think maybe less tengus early game would be still be enough to harass and IW aren't as good against PK's as people think. Good micro and PK's will win, so $150 price is reasonable.

dudes stop trying to change a game that was just unfortunately left with too small of a fan base. It was never big enough to develop fast enough for EA to bother with it. Great game. Fabulous. I love it. But unfortunately not enough people loved it. so strats took longer to make, patching took longer than it should and tourneys were never enough. It was just unlucky.

Peace RA3. You earned respect.

Quick Edit : - ps, when i say top player, i do not mean to imply i am. I am freaking like... nub. But i get the impression that i understand some of these things a bit better >_> too many people complain so much. look at allies cheese now. is it OP like everyone said? no. was there a patch? no. strats just werent made fast enough. and now i return after a while So many people play soviets, i wonder why?

This post has been edited by ALnoivmee: Oct 14 2010, 17:17 PM

Right guys, i am one of the developers of this patch, and the main reason we wanted this tourny is to check on the feedback of balance, and try to spot any bugs, has anyone tried the game out with the Random crates option enabled??

We was having problems with said crates at 1 stage, and are looking at any bugs to do with them. Also Thank You Meth for helping us out with this we are so very much grateful. Also would it be possible to have some type of bug report thread or balance change thread created to work along side this?

Also to the above post, it isn't just about the balance changes we are making, there are other changes included for instance now the Spectrum tower allows upto 5 to charge one the way it is supposed to be. Also alot of the things can change yet on the advice and feedback we get from this tourny and we will listen too.

This post has been edited by RedAlert2010: Oct 14 2010, 17:20 PM

i'm so happy bobug and red and all the others who worked on it made this patch
i wus in the playtesting program and i has to say that this is the patch we where all waiting for
and for else USE THOSE GODDAMN SEAWINGS THEY ARE OP!!!!