Heroes of Newerth

Pebbles Guide

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# 1LukDeRiff Feb 15 2011, 17:21 PM
The New Pebbles Guide created by myself with advice from Freshpro, Simba and Revyy.

As always Feedback is more than welcome and feel free to criticise me.

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# 2Gameslayer989 Feb 15 2011, 18:48 PM
nice work with 0.00 seconds tedde thumb.gif

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# 3Naeras Feb 15 2011, 19:15 PM
Awesome guide with far more information than anyone would ever need 8D

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# 4Witchking' Feb 15 2011, 21:32 PM
QUOTE(Naeras @ Feb 15 2011, 21:15 PM) *

Awesome guide with far more information than anyone would ever need 8D

Are you serious? That guide is exactly what I expect from a really solid and in-depth guide.

Very good job! More guides of this kind!

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# 5MiniDonbeE Feb 15 2011, 22:14 PM
.......... The rest u get from experience playing pebbs, like when to stun ( when ur creeps aggro the enemy hero u stun so that ur creeps will smash him biggrin.gif)


Excellent guide, this thing only needed what to dos on every matchup for it to be perfect biggrin.gif best guide ever, i dont need it since pebs = my love ohmy.gif... seriously the only thing this didnt say was the really meticulous stuff that you learn from experience biggrin.gif

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# 6Rizky Feb 15 2011, 22:56 PM
Afaik pebbles' movespeed isn't the lowest of all heroes since Devourer has the same. tongue.gif

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# 7LukDeRiff Feb 16 2011, 00:16 AM
So does Defiler but together with those he has the lowest base ms in the entire pool.

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# 8MiniDonbeE Feb 16 2011, 02:51 AM
Defiler doesnt count though, since she can lvl her third smile.gif well it does count but still not always 285 ........... Just came from a game raping with pebbs..

I was like omfg we lose guys sad.gif solo tmm, 4 teammembers on my team, 4 on theirs and 1 pubber... 1 1850psr and 1811 mmr wacko.gif like 3 guys 1650 and 1 1750.... me 1745 psr going by psrs xD and like 1 or 2 more 1700s rest 1650+... i was like gg guys sad.gif we lose.


Sup i go my famous pebbles mid against flint beastwood 1850 scrub and i go all over hisface and just win..... all of my team had possitive, all of his had negative kd, we pause and say gg pebbs 2 stronk.. half of their team rages quits without gg and concede biggrin.gif extra coins cuz of ppl being nabs and conceding in the 24 min mark ohhh yeah

Pebbs ftw biggrin.gif

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# 9Brutality_ Feb 16 2011, 03:20 AM
Ok great guide. However, I am confused on perhaps the most important part.

You say that the two hit combo is the stalagmites followed by a chuck of a target onto itself.

Then you show this deals 300*2 + 300+60. But how do u get the 300*2 if you lead with stalagmites. They have to have been chucked to take double damage. you are leading with stalagmites. I am missing something here, what is it?

Also, very important. To throw someone on to themselves you just click it to where both green circles are on the same target or what?

Thanks Alot
Brutality

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# 10Melker Feb 16 2011, 06:50 AM
So far, found only one mistake - where you explain that codex is better than spellshards when ganking alone. Even though it most likely does more damage if you get codex, you didn't notice that codex also does magic damage and most likely forgot to reduce the damage from magic armor.


Another point. What if all the enemies get mystic vestments? Because usually when pebbles goes onto a savage sick streak+ they tend to get it, unless they are from the -1600 bracket. Would codex still be better than spellshards?

Also, there is a way to build pebbles so that he wont be totally useless lategame, just get steamboots, portal key, daemonic and charged hammer. Works pretty well most of the time, since he hits like a truck and with such an amazing attack speed he'll do wonders on the battlefield.

Melker

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# 11Naidonis Feb 16 2011, 08:50 AM
To be honest at level 8 the most damage does this skill build:
1/2/1/2/1/2/2/4
And I'm confused that u choose striders. I always go enchanted marchers.
With striders you can do nothing in teamfights + you can't chase with them. Before nerf it was good item, but now i don't get why people get striders on pebbles.

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# 12RogerDodger Feb 16 2011, 12:51 PM
This guide is really good and in depth, but there's one thing that you and almost everyone who plays Pebbles seems to overlook.

Skilling the 4th rank of Stalagmites at lv7 is really terrible. It only adds 40 damage (80 combo damage) compared to Chuck which gives 75 damage (90 combo damage). Chuck's range also increases with levels (unlike Stalagmites) and is better used as a nuke for harassing due to its lower CD. A level 7 Pebbles with 4 chuck 3 stalag is much more flexible than a level 7 Pebbles with 3 chuck 4 stalag.

It's a pretty small thing, but there's really no point getting stalag rank 4 over chuck rank 4.

This post has been edited by RogerDodger: Feb 16 2011, 12:55 PM

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# 13Gameslayer989 Feb 16 2011, 16:51 PM
QUOTE

I was like omfg we lose guys sad.gif solo tmm, 4 teammembers on my team, 4 on theirs and 1 pubber... 1 1850psr and 1811 mmr wacko.gif like 3 guys 1650 and 1 1750.... me 1745 psr going by psrs xD and like 1 or 2 more 1700s rest 1650+... i was like gg guys sad.gif we lose.


Sup i go my famous pebbles mid against flint beastwood 1850 scrub and i go all over hisface and just win..... all of my team had possitive, all of his had negative kd, we pause and say gg pebbs 2 stronk.. half of their team rages quits without gg and concede biggrin.gif extra coins cuz of ppl being nabs and conceding in the 24 min mark ohhh yeah

omfg you just described one of my games yesterday. Difference was i was on flint's team post-13661-1143531603.gif

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# 14LukDeRiff Feb 16 2011, 21:16 PM
QUOTE(Brutality_ @ Feb 16 2011, 03:20 AM) *

Ok great guide. However, I am confused on perhaps the most important part.

You say that the two hit combo is the stalagmites followed by a chuck of a target onto itself.

Then you show this deals 300*2 + 300+60. But how do u get the 300*2 if you lead with stalagmites. They have to have been chucked to take double damage. you are leading with stalagmites. I am missing something here, what is it?

Also, very important. To throw someone on to themselves you just click it to where both green circles are on the same target or what?

Thanks Alot
Brutality


The reason for this is that stalagmites has a 0.2 second delay before it impacts after it reaches its destination. This should generally allow you to chuck the target before stalagmites impacts.


QUOTE(Melker @ Feb 16 2011, 06:50 AM) *

So far, found only one mistake - where you explain that codex is better than spellshards when ganking alone. Even though it most likely does more damage if you get codex, you didn't notice that codex also does magic damage and most likely forgot to reduce the damage from magic armor.
Another point. What if all the enemies get mystic vestments? Because usually when pebbles goes onto a savage sick streak+ they tend to get it, unless they are from the -1600 bracket. Would codex still be better than spellshards?

Also, there is a way to build pebbles so that he wont be totally useless lategame, just get steamboots, portal key, daemonic and charged hammer. Works pretty well most of the time, since he hits like a truck and with such an amazing attack speed he'll do wonders on the battlefield.

Melker


I took the reduction into account when calculating the damage values and I think that codex will come out at top even if you take mystic vestments into account.
Frostfield will probably loose damage wise if you add mystic vestments however you will still hit more enemies most of the time making it more cost effecient anyways.

About your late game build. I know that it exists and that is why Daemonic Breasplate is included in the luxury items. However even though Pebbles can maintain viability to a certain degree he peaks in the late early and early midgame. That is the reason you pick Pebbles for and not because he can be useful late with the right items.

QUOTE(Naidonis @ Feb 16 2011, 08:50 AM) *

To be honest at level 8 the most damage does this skill build:
1/2/1/2/1/2/2/4
And I'm confused that u choose striders. I always go enchanted marchers.
With striders you can do nothing in teamfights + you can't chase with them. Before nerf it was good item, but now i don't get why people get striders on pebbles.


Boots is something where a lot of players have their special preferences on boots and I generally don't argue about that since people stick to their choice most of the time.
As the guide proposes Striders are still the best boots if you want to be extremely aggressive early on.
If you are mid and have rune control you can for instance do that. Then Striders come in handy because of their cheap price and huge mobility.
When it comes to choosing in between Steamboots and Ghost Marchers I prefers Steamboots since the portal key offers basically all the positioning you need for ganking and initiating team fights while
offering some survivability and mana. The attack speed is not too bad either.

QUOTE(RogerDodger @ Feb 16 2011, 12:51 PM) *

This guide is really good and in depth, but there's one thing that you and almost everyone who plays Pebbles seems to overlook.

Skilling the 4th rank of Stalagmites at lv7 is really terrible. It only adds 40 damage (80 combo damage) compared to Chuck which gives 75 damage (90 combo damage). Chuck's range also increases with levels (unlike Stalagmites) and is better used as a nuke for harassing due to its lower CD. A level 7 Pebbles with 4 chuck 3 stalag is much more flexible than a level 7 Pebbles with 3 chuck 4 stalag.

It's a pretty small thing, but there's really no point getting stalag rank 4 over chuck rank 4.


Yes you are correct, I idid the number crunching one night but totally forgot about it. The build displayed is the standard and I am so used to it that I automatically assumed it would be best.

I guess sometimes the standard is not the best. Thanks for the reminder smile.gif

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# 15Rizky Feb 16 2011, 22:26 PM
Btw, does chuck have a double-tap function? Ofc I could test it myself, but if people know it already then.

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# 16KnightsCrotchHolder Feb 21 2011, 10:31 AM
QUOTE(LukDeRiff @ Feb 15 2011, 19:21 PM) *

As always Feedback is more than welcome and feel free to criticise me.

Your math is either misleading or wrong and I posted several improvements on the HoN forums http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showpost...amp;postcount=2

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# 171aser Feb 21 2011, 14:48 PM
Why not post them here?

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# 18minjung Feb 21 2011, 15:55 PM
QUOTE(KnightsCrotchHolder @ Feb 21 2011, 10:31 AM) *

Your math is either misleading or wrong and I posted several improvements on the HoN forums http://forums.heroesofnewerth.com/showpost...amp;postcount=2


^this

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# 19KnightsCrotchHolder Feb 21 2011, 23:09 PM
QUOTE(1aser @ Feb 21 2011, 16:48 PM) *

Why not post them here?

QUOTE(Korrigan;13077422)
That's incorrect. It increases your damage by 33%.


Incorrect again. Without Spellshards (3) you would only deal 823 of the 1095 damage (Magic Armor 5,5). With Spellshards (3) you would deal 1095 damage.


Again: you would not be dealing 1495 damage. You would be dealing 1124 damage (Magic Armor 5,5). Still more than 1095 damage (Spellshards (3)) and for only 3000g (Codex (1)) instead of the 4575g for Spellshards (3).


2 Heroes with Spellshards: 1095+600=1695
2 Heroes with Frostfield: (1295+800)*0,752=1575

3 Heroes with Spellshards: 1095+2*600=2295
3 Heroes with Frostfield: (1295+2*800)*0,752=2177

4 Heroes with Spellshards: 1095+3*600=2895
4 Heroes with Frostfield: (1295+3*800)*0,752=2778

5 Heroes with Spellshards: 1095+4*600=3495
5 Heroes with Frostfield: (1295+4*800)*0,752=3380

Fixed.


As you can see Spellshards (3) always deals more damage in this best-case scenario (All heroes hit with stun and chuck, one of them chucked -> maybe possible in combination with a Tempest Ultimate?).

There you go.

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# 20LukDeRiff Feb 23 2011, 06:05 AM
woooops I am just heading to school now and will take a closer look at your maths later. Looks pretty solid from a first look though.

However if you have feedback please post it here smile.gif

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