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M10s shouldn't have infantry crush...

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# 1bopokippo Feb 16 2012, 18:37 PM
Really I mean come on. As PE or Wehr there is not effective way to stop a pack of 4 or more M10s. The best choice (as Wehr) is AT guns but they can be killed by just a few shots from M10s so they're kind of a good for killing 1 M10 soft counter. As PE its terrible. They just squish your schrek squads to jelly and obliterate all your halftracks. Even the panthers get steamrolled as the pack just circles it, squashing infantry trying to protect it. If someone could name an effective way that PE can really counter m10 spam, please tell me. I find their cheap cost another factor.

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# 2svenskakrigsmakten Feb 16 2012, 18:59 PM
well 4 m10s is 1200mp and 220 fuel you should be able to make some kind of defensives and BTW never leave your PAk alone back it up with mines and a gren squad

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# 3Deda Feb 16 2012, 19:16 PM
A tellermine can oneshot an m10, counter them with ATHT's and a munitions halftrack. Plonk - no forward momentum for you! Stagger your AT guns so they cover approach lanes and can be turned quickly to help eachother, a mine near an AT gun can ruin the amis day as well as a few tanktraps randomly placed so the m10 has to weave around them and your infantry can hide behind them.

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# 4Hamster108 Feb 16 2012, 21:38 PM
order your grens to halt and they won't end up under the treads. 3-4 grens would make mince of those m10s

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# 5Naeras Feb 16 2012, 22:06 PM
If you pop inspired assault, you can kill an M10 in two shreck shots. It's not really an issue.

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# 6S73v0 Feb 16 2012, 23:47 PM
QUOTE(Hamster108 @ Feb 17 2012, 07:38 AM) *

order your grens to halt and they won't end up under the treads. 3-4 grens would make mince of those m10s


This. Ordering your grens to walk around makes them more likely to run into the treads. Also 4 m10s is a very expensive counter to grens, snipers are a far better counter.

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# 7tjw1107 Feb 20 2012, 13:30 PM
M10 crush is an exploit that has never been banned but should be.

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# 8sheriff_McLawDog Feb 20 2012, 14:01 PM
QUOTE(tjw1107 @ Feb 20 2012, 08:30 AM) *

M10 crush is an exploit that has never been banned but should be.

since when? Was infantry crush not supposed to be enabled for this tank? But is supposed to be enabled for all other tanks?

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# 9bercerus Feb 20 2012, 14:22 PM
QUOTE(S73v0 @ Feb 16 2012, 23:47 PM) *

This. Ordering your grens to walk around makes them more likely to run into the treads. Also 4 m10s is a very expensive counter to grens, snipers are a far better counter.



no you got the wrong point. nobody ever said about BUILD MASS M10s TO COUNTER GREN. but its about if when facing mass m10, line of pak is not a hard counter anymore. m10 got pretty good acc vs inf target with good rate of fire and excellent speed, its easily can survive shot and run behind pak and shoot gun's crew down JUST REQUIRE 2 SHOTS PER PAK TO KILL.

and when pak are not tor reliable against m10s, this call for gren with shreck. but again, they just run over your shreck blob and 4 men per squad of gren make they lose combat effectiveness too fast when got crush. THIS IS THE POINT, M10 EASILY TO CRUSH CAPABILITY MAKE IT DEADLY AGAINST ALL KIND OF TARGET OR IN SHORT [OVER POWERED]


last option is mass panthers in same cost of enemy mass m10s. and you just got less number and less firing tank blob

oh and teller and tread break? in large 2vs2 map like duclair or Mcgechen at the late game where most obstacle gone. its nearly impossible to predict attack route. and tread break? how much ATHT you gonna have? even with AmmoHT, the delay between tread break shot is enough opening for m10 blob to run close and kill your ATHT. and even worse with armor doc. they just hit self repair

or about back up your unit with 88s? my brain say its BS for have to use special unit to counter basic unit.


and even if you succeed to kill m10 blob by method from above(combine arms, well predict mines, super micro ATHT for tread break every m10, etc)

you think its make sense? that axis player must brain storm to make perfect combine arms strat and pull out micro skill to max for counter SINGLE TYPE UNIT SPAM WITH BRAINLESS ATTACK TACTIC, JUST FIND SHORTEST ROUTE AND RUN FAST TO REACH YOUR UNIT BACK?

in game, if game end with match draw, by one side put less afford than other. I CALL IT UNBALANCE

WINNER IN GAME SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO PLAY HARDER AND SMARTER!!!

This post has been edited by bercerus: Feb 20 2012, 14:57 PM

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# 10madner Feb 20 2012, 14:35 PM
The only solution is to play that same strategy to lvl20 and pray that someone will show you how to stop it. Maybe it will happen.

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# 11sheriff_McLawDog Feb 20 2012, 15:03 PM
QUOTE(bercerus @ Feb 20 2012, 09:22 AM) *



oh and teller and tread break? in large 2vs2 map like duclair or Mcgechen at the late game where most obstacle gone. its nearly impossible to predict attack route. and tread break? how much ATHT you gonna have?

you think its make sense? that axis player must brain storm to make perfect combine arms strat and pull out micro skill to max for counter SINGLE TYPE UNIT SPAM WITH BRAINLESS ATTACK TACTIC, JUST FIND SHORTEST ROUTE AND RUN FAST TO REACH YOUR UNIT BACK?

in game, if game end with match draw, by one side put less afford than other. I CALL IT UNBALANCE

WINNER IN GAME SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO PLAY HARDER AND SMARTER!!!


I usually build at least 2 ATHT at a time and if i didnt go t1 for ammoHT i either put FHQ up or keep running the ATHT back and forth to home territory(def ops)

I really cant see a problem with the m10. its glitchy, has weak armor, and isn't that much faster than the m18(plus m18 seems to have a larger footprint for running dudes over with)I just stick to the m18 anymore for the money. Spamming is something your opponent should never be allowed to do with any unit.. I have witnessed some pretty brutal stug spam in recent months that that is every bit as devastating or more than m10 spam, since stugs run at about the same speed as m10s, have larger crush footprint(citation needed), more armor and better accuracy+dmg+mg(vet) for anti-inf and deal about the same AT damage as a sherman. All at roughly the same cost as an M10.

I don't want to seem insensitive I just cant see the problem. I suppose I would have to arrange a match vs an m10 spammer to really feel the heft. I still hold to the Idea that mines are the game winner here, and it becomes more true the more I use them.. in the last few weeks practicing my mining, I can now get my constituents to ragequit within 10mins consistently.( a lot involving snipers baiting jeeps into mines(marinez 4ES), mining med and high muni and fuel and camping a sniper nearby to clean up the mess, etc.. they seldom ever can get rolling with tanks. As PE I mine with ammoHT and play scorched earth consistently(nosnipers sad.gif ))

This post has been edited by sheriff_McLawDog: Feb 20 2012, 15:11 PM

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# 12oscarg Feb 20 2012, 15:09 PM
If there is one thing that should have its crush removed its the stug. That thing is powerfull enough with just its AT powers.

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# 13bercerus Feb 20 2012, 15:20 PM
QUOTE(oscarg @ Feb 20 2012, 15:09 PM) *

If there is one thing that should have its crush removed its the stug. That thing is powerfull enough with just its AT powers.


yes bcuz tits trade off by didnt have a turret. just circle its BY WEAKER M10

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# 14oscarg Feb 20 2012, 15:24 PM
?

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# 15sheriff_McLawDog Feb 20 2012, 15:36 PM
QUOTE(bercerus @ Feb 20 2012, 10:20 AM) *

yes bcuz tits trade off by didnt have a turret. just circle its BY WEAKER M10

I agree. Stug should keep inf crush. all tanks should have inf crush.(including m10)

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# 16Trainzz Feb 20 2012, 15:39 PM
QUOTE(bercerus @ Feb 20 2012, 15:22 PM) *

no you got the wrong point. nobody ever said about BUILD MASS M10s TO COUNTER GREN. but its about if when facing mass m10, line of pak is not a hard counter anymore. m10 got pretty good acc vs inf target with good rate of fire and excellent speed, its easily can survive shot and run behind pak and shoot gun's crew down JUST REQUIRE 2 SHOTS PER PAK TO KILL.

and when pak are not tor reliable against m10s, this call for gren with shreck. but again, they just run over your shreck blob and 4 men per squad of gren make they lose combat effectiveness too fast when got crush. THIS IS THE POINT, M10 EASILY TO CRUSH CAPABILITY MAKE IT DEADLY AGAINST ALL KIND OF TARGET OR IN SHORT [OVER POWERED]
last option is mass panthers in same cost of enemy mass m10s. and you just got less number and less firing tank blob

oh and teller and tread break? in large 2vs2 map like duclair or Mcgechen at the late game where most obstacle gone. its nearly impossible to predict attack route. and tread break? how much ATHT you gonna have? even with AmmoHT, the delay between tread break shot is enough opening for m10 blob to run close and kill your ATHT. and even worse with armor doc. they just hit self repair

or about back up your unit with 88s? my brain say its BS for have to use special unit to counter basic unit.
and even if you succeed to kill m10 blob by method from above(combine arms, well predict mines, super micro ATHT for tread break every m10, etc)

you think its make sense? that axis player must brain storm to make perfect combine arms strat and pull out micro skill to max for counter SINGLE TYPE UNIT SPAM WITH BRAINLESS ATTACK TACTIC, JUST FIND SHORTEST ROUTE AND RUN FAST TO REACH YOUR UNIT BACK?

in game, if game end with match draw, by one side put less afford than other. I CALL IT UNBALANCE

WINNER IN GAME SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO PLAY HARDER AND SMARTER!!!


Sorry, but this is ridiculous. I've never lost a game because of M10 crush and when I lost against M10 spam then I did something wrong. It becomes more and more ridiculously in the balance forums. Next thread is about Crocs or Tetrachs being OP. Games are not decided by balance, but by skill. Sorry, but this is the truth. Trying to improve instead of whining works soo much better, but hardly anyone wants to realize.

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# 17Tommy. Feb 20 2012, 16:00 PM
QUOTE(tjw1107 @ Feb 20 2012, 13:30 PM) *

M10 crush is an exploit that has never been banned but should be.

lolwut

If M10 crush was made an exploit, then so should jeep/bike/ketten pushing.
And capwalking.
And using cover.
Fuck it, no one is allowed any micro- rally points set to your opponents HQ only, A-Move Go!
tongue.gif

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# 18HoBo223 Feb 20 2012, 16:31 PM
The only reason I can see the m10 being an exploited bug is because it's model was quirky, IIRC. I thought Kolaris explained it once, it gave the M10 a slight advantage to crushing inf (Other than it's speed) over the other tanks.

I mean really, though, like it's THAT bad. M10s are fodder compared to other tanks.

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# 19djw2104 Feb 20 2012, 16:57 PM
QUOTE(tjw1107 @ Feb 20 2012, 13:30 PM) *

M10 crush is an exploit that has never been banned but should be.


Trolling?

In combat if you stand in front of the enemy's armour it will not stop - it will just run over and squish/crush you. So therefore, it has a place in the game.

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# 20Naeras Feb 20 2012, 16:57 PM
QUOTE(bercerus @ Feb 20 2012, 15:22 PM) *

no you got the wrong point. nobody ever said about BUILD MASS M10s TO COUNTER GREN. but its about if when facing mass m10, line of pak is not a hard counter anymore. m10 got pretty good acc vs inf target with good rate of fire and excellent speed, its easily can survive shot and run behind pak and shoot gun's crew down JUST REQUIRE 2 SHOTS PER PAK TO KILL.

and when pak are not tor reliable against m10s, this call for gren with shreck. but again, they just run over your shreck blob and 4 men per squad of gren make they lose combat effectiveness too fast when got crush. THIS IS THE POINT, M10 EASILY TO CRUSH CAPABILITY MAKE IT DEADLY AGAINST ALL KIND OF TARGET OR IN SHORT [OVER POWERED]
last option is mass panthers in same cost of enemy mass m10s. and you just got less number and less firing tank blob

oh and teller and tread break? in large 2vs2 map like duclair or Mcgechen at the late game where most obstacle gone. its nearly impossible to predict attack route. and tread break? how much ATHT you gonna have? even with AmmoHT, the delay between tread break shot is enough opening for m10 blob to run close and kill your ATHT. and even worse with armor doc. they just hit self repair

or about back up your unit with 88s? my brain say its BS for have to use special unit to counter basic unit.
and even if you succeed to kill m10 blob by method from above(combine arms, well predict mines, super micro ATHT for tread break every m10, etc)

you think its make sense? that axis player must brain storm to make perfect combine arms strat and pull out micro skill to max for counter SINGLE TYPE UNIT SPAM WITH BRAINLESS ATTACK TACTIC, JUST FIND SHORTEST ROUTE AND RUN FAST TO REACH YOUR UNIT BACK?

in game, if game end with match draw, by one side put less afford than other. I CALL IT UNBALANCE

WINNER IN GAME SHOULD BE THE ONE WHO PLAY HARDER AND SMARTER!!!

Okay, so, if he's building mass M10s to counter your grenadiers, I have one question: how the hell did he get the map control for that to be effective?

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