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GLA vs Toxin

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# 41Leikeze Nov 9 2019, 03:22 AM
They may be on a lower level, but it is always good to give your observations.

50k games are all about the overall strategy you're using, as spamming the wrong thing in the wrong place at the wrong time will always make you lose against somebody doing the the opposite.

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# 42Terminator 88 Dec 27 2019, 06:08 AM
Thanks, man! Yes, sometimes it is clear that some spam attempts are not effective. A friend of mine lost whole limit with hydralisks trying to destroy the defense of one guy, who lost just one photon cannon. smile.gif The same is with Generals- I have seen so ineffective spams, that it make me feel bad for the spammer. Of course the coin has second side, too- I have seen very effective spams with tens of Quad Cannons against AF General or Toxin Tractors in bunches against Toxin General who seemed quite unprepared for disaster like this with his Toxin Tunnels. smile.gif
I like the vanilla GLA and the Toxin General, because I can spam quite hard with them without worrying too much for the tactics. The vanilla faction has cheaper units and you can rely on heavy spamming even harder, but from other hand the Toxin General has stronger units and against infantry are more capable, too.

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# 43Leikeze Dec 27 2019, 16:32 PM
Yes, very true points.

Here is a good example of how spam is not so effective against a more powerful counter from Age of Empires 2.


I don't know if you play AOE2 or not, but this example can be used across any RTS franchise and still ring true. You always want the most ideal composition of units being used in the most efficient ways.

In ZH, this is more essential than in many other games, as the loss of units is far more dangerous over the course of the game, it having such limited supplies.

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# 44Terminator 88 Jan 2 2020, 11:38 AM
I am not a big expert in AoE games, but I know them relatively good. I know many RTS games and I believe that Generals is similar to most RTS games which is good for the players, who have experience in other games from the genre. For instance I have a friend of mine who is relatively a high level player on SC and he is doing quite good on ZH, even after big breaks, because of his overall RTS experience.
In 50 k games I try to build powerful economics and to try to overwhelm my opponents with many, many units. It is not something uncommon to have 6- 7 Arms dealer buildings and to purchase units from all of them. For this type of game you need twice more Black markets. In such games I don't worry if I use Scorpions instead of Marauders against USA factions with many Avengers, just because of the sheer numbers. Once you have such numbers, you are much more relaxed. Even if your opponent stops your attack and proves that he has great defense, you can stop for a while to gather bigger army and to attack again. If the case is not like this, I just push non stop, until the other guy collapses. The bounty skill is great for such massive battles. Your economy is so powerful and nobody can surprise you.
Happy new year, by the way! smile.gif

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# 45Leikeze Feb 4 2020, 02:15 AM
So, after getting more games on 3 vs 3 50k lately, the GLA vs Toxin battles are still just a bit disappointing.

So many players still neglect adding a few Tox Scorpions into their Quad Army so they can engage both the GLA guys Quad army, and whatever air there is to worry about.

It's made especially hard to keep from informing your allies of their strategic mistake when they spam Quads in a ground war.

Toxin Scorpions should be preached to the community on a daily basis.

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# 46Terminator 88 Mar 25 2020, 12:44 PM
QUOTE(Leikeze @ Feb 4 2020, 02:15 AM) *

So, after getting more games on 3 vs 3 50k lately, the GLA vs Toxin battles are still just a bit disappointing.

So many players still neglect adding a few Tox Scorpions into their Quad Army so they can engage both the GLA guys Quad army, and whatever air there is to worry about.

It's made especially hard to keep from informing your allies of their strategic mistake when they spam Quads in a ground war.

Toxin Scorpions should be preached to the community on a daily basis.


I am happy to see that we are on one opinion! It is non sense for me to play with Tox general and to spam with Quad Cannons. If you want to do this, you should play with vGLA or Stealth. For me Tox has most brute power from all GLA factions. He can handle in serious ground combat against most (if not all factions). Just try to fight with Tank or Laser and you will see how much better is the Tox compared with GLA. Of course I don't claim that Tox is better in every aspect of the game from the vGLA, but sure he has a lot of power.

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# 47Leikeze Mar 25 2020, 14:07 PM
QUOTE(Terminator 88 @ Mar 25 2020, 07:44 AM) *

I am happy to see that we are on one opinion! It is non sense for me to play with Tox general and to spam with Quad Cannons. If you want to do this, you should play with vGLA or Stealth. For me Tox has most brute power from all GLA factions. He can handle in serious ground combat against most (if not all factions). Just try to fight with Tank or Laser and you will see how much better is the Tox compared with GLA. Of course I don't claim that Tox is better in every aspect of the game from the vGLA, but sure he has a lot of power.

There is sometimes a big push to use only Stealth on Hostile Dawn 3 vs 3's, but I find GLA or Toxin just as viable, because GLA still gets inexpensive Quads, and Tox gets a superior late-game with super strong buses. The only real advantage to Stealth is it's pre-camouflaged tunnels that make the Air player have to scan before any attack.

Tox is the best GLA against the USA's & Tank because of the tunnels and faster RPG's (the rockets fly faster).

GLA gets camouflage for tunnels and less expensive Buggies, so it can hold its own against USA's, but tank is hard to beat on some maps with it. The $900 buggies make GLA better than Tox in the late game, because Tox is stuck with $1,100 buggies that can break the bank after a while, as you're trying to mix buses in between them, which aren't cheap either. Those Tox Scorpions still make the early game super difficult for GLA if they're out-spammed.

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# 48Terminator 88 Mar 26 2020, 07:19 AM
QUOTE(Leikeze @ Mar 25 2020, 14:07 PM) *

There is sometimes a big push to use only Stealth on Hostile Dawn 3 vs 3's, but I find GLA or Toxin just as viable, because GLA still gets inexpensive Quads, and Tox gets a superior late-game with super strong buses. The only real advantage to Stealth is it's pre-camouflaged tunnels that make the Air player have to scan before any attack.

Tox is the best GLA against the USA's & Tank because of the tunnels and faster RPG's (the rockets fly faster).

GLA gets camouflage for tunnels and less expensive Buggies, so it can hold its own against USA's, but tank is hard to beat on some maps with it. The $900 buggies make GLA better than Tox in the late game, because Tox is stuck with $1,100 buggies that can break the bank after a while, as you're trying to mix buses in between them, which aren't cheap either. Those Tox Scorpions still make the early game super difficult for GLA if they're out-spammed.


I meant that Stealth is better only in aspect of Quad Cannons compared with the Toxin. Actually Stealth is my least favorite general. I like to overpower my opponents and he hasn't got that firepower.
I am more of a strategic guy than tactical one. I prefer to use A LOT of units to outpower my opponents. In such mas battles is almost impossible to use tactics. Before purchasing the Toxin shells and Anthrax beta upgrades the vGLA tanks lose in most scenarios from the Toxin's tanks (even when they are more I calculate the prices and compare them in the respectively numbers for one particular amount of money). After the upgrades (including Anthrax gamma) vGLA tanks generally win. If we add the expensive Buggies and Quads the things go in favor of the vanilla faction. But the base defenses and the infantry units are in favor of the Toxin general.
From my experience with the 50 k games I play I feel that the Toxin is somehow stronger in direct clashes. He has early advantage (just think about the Toxin rebels) over vGLA, which he can exploit good- general promotions (including Cash bounty which can give you a lot of money), stronger veteran units, which are upgraded from the parts of the destroyed enemy units, access to neutral buildings and etc. Also if the map is not super large and doesn't allow mass battles it is still bad for the vGLA (even after the upgrades), because they need to use more tanks to beat the money equivalent of the Toxin's tanks and there wouldn't be enough space to send all of your units on the front line.
Never mind, I think it become a little longer. smile.gif And also my experience is with 50 k games.

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