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# 1AsTheRuinsFall Sep 14 2007, 22:11 PM
List em, lol.

dervish are good if there is not anti air ( of course any one with a brain makes some)

amplifiers i've heard in the other threads? how so? their ability does great damage but they get killed fast, and you can't leave your army to protect them because the damage will also hit them.




Vertigo, seems to be great at sniping the hard points though, especially if the enemy has no stealth detection.


Thoughts?

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# 2AgmLauncher Sep 14 2007, 22:25 PM
You have to use amplifiers in conjunction with the Novus defense turrets. It will render them 100% invulnerable to the walkers unless the walkers step on them (but you can always move them away).

It's also handy to research into tier 4 (though not necessary) to gain access to the overclocking patch. The amplifiers will move faster (for better kiting), but will have less health. However that doesn't matter because with the proper defenses, you can protect them.

The key is to have layers of those defenses leading back to your base, because inevitably the walker will destroy them as it gets closer (or if the Hierarchy player realizes he should be building units as well as walkers).

I've found that Amplifiers + Vertigo are a lethal combo.

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# 3S2Zrathustra Sep 14 2007, 22:25 PM
My Inverters suck against your walkers tbh tongue.gif

This post has been edited by Ithildur: Sep 14 2007, 22:25 PM

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# 4AsTheRuinsFall Sep 14 2007, 22:26 PM
Yes, I'm double posting.

I've gotten the impression that walker plasma turrents are not very accurate so you can dance your units to take low damage.

Do the novus units fire on the move"? Sometimes it seems like they do to me and sometimes it seems like they don't.

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# 5AgmLauncher Sep 14 2007, 22:28 PM
No, you won't be able to dance wave amplifiers. They must deploy, and they get stronger the longer they continue firing. The plasma turrets are absolutely devastating, which is why you need to use amplifiers in conjunction with those defenses.

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# 6AsTheRuinsFall Sep 15 2007, 15:59 PM
I tried the ampliefies versus triumph, eventually i succeeded in taking out his walkers with the ampliefies but it took a hell of a long time. the only reason they survived was because of the towers throughing the plasma back at the walkers.


Also it looked like the amps attack spread throughout the walker hardpoints, does that happen or am i seeing things?

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# 7Shadow Stryker Nov 2 2009, 00:41 AM
Happens if you reasearch (forgot what exacly) and if theyre the same hardpoints.
Amplifiers can move after they started firing (pretty sure), and they have a long range and low health so its best to set them behind other units/ structures.

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# 8vOddy Mar 13 2010, 14:21 PM
QUOTE(AgmLauncher @ Sep 15 2007, 00:25 AM) *

You have to use amplifiers in conjunction with the Novus defense turrets. It will render them 100% invulnerable to the walkers unless the walkers step on them (but you can always move them away).

It's also handy to research into tier 4 (though not necessary) to gain access to the overclocking patch. The amplifiers will move faster (for better kiting), but will have less health. However that doesn't matter because with the proper defenses, you can protect them.

The key is to have layers of those defenses leading back to your base, because inevitably the walker will destroy them as it gets closer (or if the Hierarchy player realizes he should be building units as well as walkers).

I've found that Amplifiers + Vertigo are a lethal combo.


AGM, you fail at life.


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# 9vb4 Mar 26 2010, 14:09 PM
QUOTE(vOddy @ Mar 13 2010, 14:21 PM) *

AGM, you fail at life.

Did you just insult someone via necro posting on a strategy discussion from a patch you maybe didn't even play?
There's nothing wrong with AGM's advice. It worked at that time.

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# 10vOddy Apr 1 2010, 07:44 AM
Just saying he fails, not necessarily because of what he typed in this one post.


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# 11sotpmoker Apr 5 2010, 05:40 AM
How to Win 1 on 1 against a hard Hierarchy with Massari:


Inquisitor rush.

That, is how you beat Hierarchy. Build two Flight Machinas as fast as you can and start making Inquisitors, you can start harassing as soon as you have about four I'd say. Target their Reavers, assuming they are undefended/away from the base. If you can get those down then you will seriously have fucked up their economy (a Hierarchy weakness) and slowed them down. Most of their units are prone to air attacks. A group of Inquisitors can destroy a bunch of grunts/saucers easily. Lost ones can attack air, but they're weak as hell.

Their heros can fuck your shit up, especially Nufai. You shouldn't engage them, unless you want to sacrifice a couple of guys to take Kamal/Orlock out (which isn't always a bad idea). Inquisitors will NOT be able to take out a Walker on their own. After taking out their Reavers they should only be used for harassing, scouting, and map control.

By striking a blow in their economy this should slow them down so you can tech up your units/matter engines and build your super weapon. By the time they do attack with their Walkers you should have some Peacebringers ready. Five Peacebringers can rip apart a Walker one on one, and if they do get close to your base your towers should be able to tare away the scraps.

Masari are a late game faction, near unstoppable with fully teched matter engines. If you can get past the deadly Hiearchy opening rush chances are the match is yours.

Remember to build LOTS of Architects, like 8, and always have them on whatever you're doing. This means two or three on whatever units you're building, as well as your matter engines as you're going through the tech up stage.

This post has been edited by sotpmoker: Apr 5 2010, 05:46 AM

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# 12Perfi Apr 5 2010, 05:49 AM
Guess it would work, the AI sucks hard enough not to go saucers/Orlok wink.gif

Now, that's a nicely written guide, but really, beating AIs isn't a problem, as all it does is camp up. Real players are a whole different story.

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# 13Vesuvius Apr 5 2010, 22:04 PM
Inquisitors weren't bad against humans either when I played more.

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# 14Perfi Apr 5 2010, 22:47 PM
Haven't said it was a bad strategy, I have painful memories with Inquisitor spam. I'm just saying that you can't just base a strategy on its results vs AI, as a human will adapt to it.

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# 15Oroibahazopi Apr 7 2010, 13:40 PM
QUOTE(Perfi @ Apr 5 2010, 23:47 PM) *

Haven't said it was a bad strategy, I have painful memories with Inquisitor spam. I'm just saying that you can't just base a strategy on its results vs AI, as a human will adapt to it.

Turtle with grav turrets and phase tank spam \o/

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# 16CanYouFelix Apr 11 2010, 18:28 PM
Depends on which situation you're talking about.

If you're talking about a walker in the middle of the map then they're typically harder to deal with than if they're at the edge of your base. They'll be constantly pumping out units that will arrive right in your armies face, plus those things are beastly with the right hard points. (Beam cannons, omg.)

Air units are good vs walkers as the AA hardpoints are USELESS. But any good Hiearchy player will have Nufai on the field if there's even a chance of the enemy using air units.

I've started wondering though if there even can be a hard counter to a walking production facility than can just starting producing counters to whatever units you've decided to try and counter it with... As well as of course modify hardpoints accordingly.

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# 17Perfi Apr 11 2010, 18:39 PM
QUOTE(CanYouFelix @ Apr 11 2010, 20:28 PM) *

Depends on which situation you're talking about.

If you're talking about a walker in the middle of the map then they're typically harder to deal with than if they're at the edge of your base. They'll be constantly pumping out units that will arrive right in your armies face, plus those things are beastly with the right hard points. (Beam cannons, omg.)
If they're at the edge of your base, they'll be pumping out units that will arrive right in your base AND they'll be plasmaing you like there's no tomorrow. I'd much rather deal with a production walker.
QUOTE


Air units are good vs walkers as the AA hardpoints are USELESS. But any good Hiearchy player will have Nufai on the field if there's even a chance of the enemy using air units.

Arc turrets aren't that bad, they can scare off stuff like Saucers pretty easily. Not in high numbers, though.

QUOTE
I've started wondering though if there even can be a hard counter to a walking production facility than can just starting producing counters to whatever units you've decided to try and counter it with... As well as of course modify hardpoints accordingly.

That's a purely theoretical situation in which theory phailz. tongue.gif You aren't taking time and resources spent into adapting the walker into consideration. If you just sit in one spot playing around with a walker, you'll just get outnumbered or tech switched on. For example: they spam Ohms, you do Defilers, they switch to Dervishes, you switch into Saucers, they switch into FIs, you try to switch into Phase tanks but your economy is dead.

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# 18Defender N8 Apr 15 2010, 15:52 PM
Novus
Mirabel (snipe)
Amplifiers
Field Inverters
Ohm Robots (en-mass, use swarm with nearly dead Ohms)
Redirection Turrets (careful with these, H has a lot of anti-turret weapons)
Corrupters + Hacker Viral Bomb (bomb has good damage, but this might be risky if they figure out what you are up to)

Hierarchy:
Spitter Turrets
Defilers/Phase Tanks (both can damage multiple hardpoints per attack)
Saucers
Lost Ones
Orlok
Brutes with DFB

Masari:
Dark Peacebringer + Dark Figments
Dark Disciples + Dark Figments
Guardian Turrets (either mode)
Light Inquisitors
Light Skylords
Altea

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# 19masari Aug 6 2010, 22:17 PM
ok first ya wanna build a matter engine(if your masari) ur gonna want alot of disicples and some conquerers then hit there hard points fast and brutally if most of ur men die ur a fail...i killed about 5 walkers with that same startgy over and over again even players can't adpt to that if they don't defend there walker.but if ur really in a bad spot ur gonna want to go ull our disiples oh and everything i said was ONLY used on dark mode with sheilds at full.

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# 20Saphri Aug 12 2010, 17:30 PM
dark pbs with balance 2 for early tech walkers, light skylords with light 4 oracles for late tech walkers; can use a few balance 2 inquisitors to make the oracles invincible through stasis if you want.

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