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Update about the BFME Patch matters

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# 1Earendil Aug 1 2019, 16:54 PM
As you know, the 1.09 patch team has decided to go their own way and leave the official project from Pallando - it's no official Gamereplays Project anymore.
Because of that the current forum content has to change.
In order to make some things clear and to not confuse anybody we would like to point out some things:

1. The official BFME patch is 1.06 (like before).
2. The Beta Discussion Forum stays invisible until a new patch project starts.
3. You can not promote your patch on the forums anymore or host tournaments. Also the ladder has to be moved somewhere else. The T3A QM Ladder stays the official gamereplays ladder.
4. The current tournament can be finished here on gamereplays.

Finally, I would like to let you know that this is not a matter of inter-personal bounds or preference of the ideas of certain people. The one and only goal of Gamereplays is to keep this small community unite as good as possible.

Therefore, we still hope to find a solution together. We hope you guys rethink about the approach of your patch project and come back to the official project under the lead of Pallando. The door is always open when you are willing compromise.


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# 2M1ghty Aug 1 2019, 18:41 PM
If people are bored with the game why don't they play another RTS instead? There are plenty to choose from, SC2 for starters, although you have to be good at it. Cheat at that and you get banned for good!

Posts: 493

Game: StarCraft 2


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# 3suturbs Aug 1 2019, 19:20 PM
Hello people...

As a "everymode occasional player", I would like to add something to this discussion.

As I stated at the beginning of these issues, I would really appreciate some small changes, like hero onhorse at spawn. But "feature changes" as a mod. Like bluewizard mode with network.

I and some others like Earendil (as the most gr.org "defendant", naturally) more or less say that "13 years of gamereplays.org experience & documentation at stake" through such "feature changes" which are alot of things, are more than just "together we build NEW worlds".

A new hope? No my friends... It could be better to improve "the old as community", not as gameplay or skill. This is a more realistic hope than "recruiting news". (and think of the time needed for them to be cooked as goods)... "It will bring new recruits" is a total fallacy. A fake advertisement will bring some but not someone "loyal".

On the other hand, The purpose of increasing or keeping the BFME activity allive could better be by this: Hoping the old goodies come and play once/twice a week for few games, *without being/staying addicted". Without being bounded with toruney/QM/ladder. There is nothing to prove for no oldies.. also Without being mocked/or prefame related jokes... (by mostly less proven people) These are necessary good manners... All Because they(WE!) all above 20 now and they pursue real life matters, such as developing responsibility through small but sacrifices & decreasing "not real life things" such as a BFME playage.

Maybe you Latingo and some got bored of 2x2, QM overplaying, I can guess that. But Why don't you play FFG sometimes? Leave the reckless rival? If you really insist, Praise God's name, not any bloody's nor yourself. (This is a key method to incrase peace). Does some leave due to decrased competitiveness? I never believed so.

Better the official efforts take the changes slow and little, limit them by "non-feature/ld/power/experience based". And voting for stuff like this is not logical for thechnical content.We should keep this in mind too.

* * *

(Let me refer to the 1.09 lobbysts by your name), Dear LATINO your accompany has been kindly dictating 1.09 through "voting", through fancy ideas & advertiesement. All ok when it's radius is smaller than a PATCH...

Your main goal was increasing activity? that is ok.. All appreaciates... but when it comes to your sub-goal, it somehow involves dictating a 109 that disturbes the main game-leadership-power orientations... Plus, obviosuly, changes are to often made for boosting certain guys' or armies... True or false,, it looks like so. worst of it: 1.09 trivializes gamereplays.org patch-based experience. Henceforth making Gamereplays.org replays & guides un-reliable... for not only new ones, but also us...

Maybe, Delete Gr.org bfme section? for the owners save money from server costs? maybe...(!) Alot of data, site could be profiting by deleting BFME 1.00-106 section after 1.09 (!)

This post has been edited by suturbs: Aug 4 2019, 21:22 PM

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# 4tartar57 Aug 1 2019, 19:20 PM
no one cares morje xD

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# 5Anon` Aug 1 2019, 19:25 PM
I belong to the ones who don't see any need for patching. But I already stated in the "Future of 109" topic that no patch is not an option at this point. You probably missed that because the only thing focused on in replies to this post was my suggestion to let neutral people decide upon questionable changes.

I know that I probably won't reach out to Alan, Bwel or Dune. But I want to tell everyone who has an ear for it: Stop the discussion/flame, everything has been said. Stick to this community, we can't afford to split. Get back to the table and work out a patch that is acceptable for everyone (not only for those who are bored, not for those who totally neglect changes) - together will Palla.

This post has been edited by Anon`: Aug 1 2019, 19:51 PM

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# 6Beterwel Aug 2 2019, 00:31 AM
I have seen bad Posts from both sides of this argument. However, you guys just don’t understand what is going on. The most activity on this forum is created by players that support 1.09. Other games like Bfme2 have different patch sections, but it is so hard to support one for a fairly active patch (the current 1.09). Just because things are not going your way. Palla never was the leader of this project, he was just the coder. In fact as long as I was involved with the patch process there was no leader, but a group of people actively discussing, testing and deciding what changes should be put in. You guys act like nobody has/had a say in it, but thats just lies. I’ve seen things being implemented that were recommended by different players; me, Dune, orange, palla, shanks, alan, noldor and even others have had their influence. You guys cba to get involved with testing and recommending advices, too lazy or busy playing other games, then cry the process is undemocratic and assign a leader and decide on a way (going back to 1.06) that like 4 people really want. You guys are much more undemocratic than us, now even leveraging the power and your opinion to force our patch from the platform we have been using for Bfme for years (gamereplays). Forcing us to go somewhere else. This makes me think of NSDAP practices. Stop abusing your power and let us use this site for 1.09 patch too, havent we all been part of this community for years?

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# 7Pallando Aug 2 2019, 04:52 AM
I did not want to "discuss" this anymore in public, but I think I will have to because there are statements here that are incomplete or just make no sense.

QUOTE(LATINO @ Aug 1 2019, 18:10 PM) *

I doubt the basic 1.09 players wanna start from 1.06 and have only 1-2 new things rather stick to original 1.06. We could work together on 1.09 and adjust it and updating it as we just did with the last one. Removing LS, Reducing Orcs, Nerfing Gimli.


I made a version of a 1.06 based patch at the end of July including ~30 changes in it. But it seems you never had interest. The issue is that we put 300-400 changes out there, most of them can't be explained, they're just there. What I understood more and more as the project continued is that 1.09 changes the game drastically; the game that people have loved for the last 13 years. And then you expect these people to try the patch, or even read through the 300+ changes (that can't be explained why they are there for the most part). True, it was mainly my fault that we originally started with 1.02, but I tried to correct course after several weeks because people (not only Shanks) did not like using 1.02 as a base. They don't need to play the patch in order to say that they disapprove 300-400 changes at once.


QUOTE(LATINO @ Aug 1 2019, 18:10 PM) *

I doubt many of this players willing to join a Palla project again because when flames will arrives he may give up again. Therefore, we will keep working on 1.09, improve it make it the best possible by listening to people and adapting it to 1.06 but still with our global changes.


I was crystal clear when I said in the beginning of July what my plan was - finish the clan wars month with 1.09 and then start over from 1.06. No one raised concern to that. I thought that people from the patch team accepted that idea mostly, at least I had no reason to think otherwise. The best things of 1.09 could've been kept and it would've majorly shrunk the change log. Then Yoshi and you asked me for another update at the end of July, and this is when I refused to update. Because I wanted to follow the path that I announced publicly to everyone - and obviously no one of you ever had any intention to follow it. Then you (and/or Yoshi) told me I fucked everyone over, when in reality I was dead-honest and transparent with my decision from the beginning of July. I think you fucked me over when you never made it clear to me that you had no intention of going with my plan at the end of July, and hired a new coder even one week before you asked me to bring out the new update - because you knew I was going to stick to the plan that I had announced. I believe this is also the reason why the patch project is not supported by GameReplays anymore now. I announced the plan, it seemed like we would give it a go and then you decide to go a different way without talking to anyone - neither staff nor in the patch forum.

By the way, what exactly is Palla's project? I can't recall announcing a new official project and I will be very careful to do so. The patch forum was set invisible, not renamed to "Palla's Patch Area". It's a shame BFME will be split like that when it can clearly be avoided if people get off their high horses.


Part of what Bwel said here is correct. There was not really a hierarchical structure in the patch team and it was fun for me while it lasted. There were two major issues though. For one, my expectation and the expectations of the remaining patch team were different. The patch team was hell-bent on going down with the ship if necessary, I was more reserved and like to believe there is a way to find a way that everyone can cope with. I can be an optimistic person at times, I'm sorry for that patch team! I'm still convinced there can be a way if some people stop being stubborn and see it as a community project rather than a personal achievement. Eventually though my criticism of our approach lead to issues and insults within the team and this was one of the defining moments when I noticed how far off my goal with the patch was compared to that of the other people on the team.
The second issue is that it became personal between two people. Shanks continuously poking Alan with a stick, and Alan falling for it and insulting Shanks back. That gave Shanks more reason to go against 1.09, even in stream. I don't care who is right or wrong here, both behaviors were very unprofessional. A leader would stand above it and ignore it or answer tactfully. But it was more like very animalistic behavior from both sides, comparing dick sizes all the time and see who's the stronger one.

All of that made it very difficult for me personally. Team Alan thought Shanks "wormtongued" me, Shanks thought Team Alan "wormtongued" me, so solving it seemed impossible for me no matter what. All because of the personal issues between two people. So I decided for myself to do what I think was the right thing, go with 1.06 as a base because that would initially convince more people to follow it and less changes would be included by default. Then I found out one month later that the patch team did not support that idea. So they hired another coder. That's fine, do it your way but I wonder why you never said this openly anywhere, or told me the issue with going back to 1.06. I even offered to do the extra work of implementing good things from 1.09 for the sake of starting from 1.06.

I'll say it again for the third time, but I'm still convinced something good can come out of this with a 1.06 base, but people have to stop being stubborn on all sides. I suggest everyone to take a deep breath and work this issue out in their minds. I know people on both sides are pissed, but that's the reality that can be changed. It's fucking stupid to split the community over this issue.

This post has been edited by Pallando: Aug 2 2019, 05:07 AM

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# 8suturbs Aug 2 2019, 21:15 PM
QUOTE(Beterwel @ Aug 2 2019, 02:31 AM) *
The most activity on this forum is created by players that support 1.09.
that shows nothing my friend. literally nothing... for example I am active so what?

the most activity, or the most at all, is in a empty tin can.

QUOTE
he was just the coder
nice try my friend.. and who do you think you are? just LATNIO YOSHI and BETERWEL few experts and such... How many are you? doesnt matter, are you %99.9? its not a political orientation, it cant be resolved through democracy. I appreciated our hitler (aka orange) intervened this.

QUOTE
You guys cba to get involved with testing and recommending advices, too lazy or busy playing other games, then cry the process is undemocratic and assign
if not a hitler, you have a staling in you my friend.

BTW bfme2 rotwk don't change too much. They fix stuff. And make mode like every normal community.. Also those games are more "micro based, age of empire-bfme mix" games. If you keep on intending to mess with "main engines of BFME", well go to play other games fellows..

I repeat, there had been officious/meddlesome/biased vector on the whole 1.09 thing, and you say not trying...yes, i dont try cocain/smoke/alcohol to know how it hurts kidneys and such... i am 35 barely scratch on my original teeth and kidney and such; i like healthy life, as well ass quality game like BFME. health care ok, but no surgery!

QUOTE(M1ghty @ Aug 1 2019, 20:41 PM) *

If people are bored with the game why don't they play another RTS instead? There are plenty to choose from, SC2 for starters, although you have to be good at it. Cheat at that and you get banned for good!
Exactly my friend. best simple suggestion on this topic.... Nobods is literally dictator here. Evereything is clear for those aren't blind

This post has been edited by suturbs: Aug 2 2019, 21:34 PM

Posts: 1,280

Game: Battle for Middle Earth


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# 9TheTower Aug 2 2019, 21:22 PM
Hello,
I've stayed quiet about the patch until now cause i thought flaming was useless (even if it made me laught a lot). But I can not stay calm after the recent events. I am in total disagrement of the choices of the admins. First you have punished only one side of the event , wtf is this. Shanks flamed same or even more than alan and gahvin , but yeah nothing happends to him ?! Wtf is this ? You even let shanks his admin rights and let him edit the patch messages to enable new players to download the patch. It's a disgrace ! He's a "ROTWK commentator" but edit bfme 1 stuff. If at least it was orange i wouldn't complain that much. It's a disgrace.
Secondly , what is the purpose of these sanctions? The patch will happend no matter what even if shanks and his crew , like he loves to say , want it to fail. When you could let the topic to let the comunity gives their feeds back you prefer to make it impossible.
To end, this forum is small and you are unstaff the most active player and even banning them ! What do you want , the end of the bfme forum in gr? Cause i can assure you that its what will happend. Do you espect us to stay here where only fail tournements happend ? Like the unfinished tourneys of shanks? No , all the active players will stay with the active player.
To conclude : I totaly disagree with what is happening and i think you should let the discussions of the patch and if you want to punish the behavior of some guys , punish all of them and don't suck shanks dick by doing his dirty job.
Thanks

This post has been edited by TheTower: Aug 2 2019, 21:33 PM

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Clan: The Last Knights of Middle-Earth

Game: Battle for Middle Earth


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# 10suturbs Aug 2 2019, 22:06 PM
What have you just said? I cant compute sorry Tower.
BTW I could nearly bet you had said smth about this topic, but using another account. but nvm. I am not fond of bets.

Posts: 1,280

Game: Battle for Middle Earth


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# 11suturbs Aug 2 2019, 22:48 PM
QUOTE
I was more reserved and like to believe there is a way to find a way that *everyone* can cope with.

Yea the correct spirit my friend Palla... not the filthy "democracy".

As Wilson was quoted according to literature: "The government(campaigns, in our case), which was designed for the people(each and everyone amap), has got into the hands of the bosses and their employers, the special interests. An invisible empire (Latin king) has been set up above the forms of democracy". Woodrow Wilson

Emperror latino and his colleagues kept relying on the voting about undefined "new patch" for a long time and way. Got motivated and made propaganda of the undefined this, got some applause; yet worse: made even themselves forget what was just happening. People said "yes yes" more than just few times to "new things", and got used to "not thinking" after the promises (like the Hitler society) especially via new upcoming attractive changes such as involving boromir, gimli, whatsoever....

Many said yes to "new things", includng me but never to what every specificy you guys put in it afterwards. Nobody promised for the entire future. Entire possible newnesses... You ask participation, we did through forums. you sitll insisted on adding fancy things, of 1.02 or imgaination. Thats all..

Not all new things popping up from your emperror desires are good. New isn't sacred, old isn't shit, different isn't a bogyman.

A society that thinks is more powerful than what "blindly followed leaders" could offer. You the leaders also, should be discovering & benefiting this other than some cheap tricks that look fine & beneficient at superficial glance but weak in real order & peace.

I believe Latino is as a leader, one of unique leaders in BFME. but he should be patient before being mature and free from secret agendas that are more or less injust/disturbing/dictating. (Plus to things i mentioned above) such as favouring his lovely Gondor (for his ways) lol
Spoiler
eagle weaker vs rog doesn't count near this, and even a mask; i am probably its not first but originally-every time effective user, and know why it is updated! a threat to mainstream micro focus! special note: *when u focus on such things, usual map control weakens*


Non-flesh/non-blood made, unborn/nonfather, the unique God knows what is the truth (I haveto keep this long coz some keep believing that they are "some gods"). Not us. But I just say what i see with the eye.

Good luck, and Good night.

This post has been edited by suturbs: Aug 4 2019, 21:27 PM


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# 12TheTower Aug 2 2019, 22:59 PM
QUOTE(suturbs @ Aug 2 2019, 22:06 PM) *

What have you just said? I cant compute sorry Tower.
BTW I could nearly bet you had said smth about this topic, but using another account. but nvm. I am not fond of bets.


Wow yeah I'm truly a no life guy who make other counts...you kidding I hope.
And i think my point is preaty easy to get you just have to read my post.

Posts: 77

Clan: The Last Knights of Middle-Earth

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# 13Shanks Aug 3 2019, 06:54 AM
This is actually so funny.

„Doing Shanks dirty job „

Why you guys expect from others the same attitudes like from yourself ?

For me , it seems like you are doing the dirty job for someone else by using the same words and flames
Why can’t you just be yourself ?

„Unfinished tournaments“ „ratwk“

Come on ... come with something unique , that got already boring... innit

I don’t know , what makes you think that it is only me who is responsible for all that , what happened

But thank you! That you think so much about me , that my name shines in every post of yours 😍

When it comes to what happened with the „patch“ ??
I guess Orange was clear enough as well as Pallando was when he realized that, this is not gonna be a good thing for the bfme community , he wanted to start over from 0 based on 1.06 and also Felixanius was for that and nearly everyone was against 1 shotted gates and op orcs ( so i hope you get my point that this isn’t only me )

Anyways , thank you for using my name
When I am back from my vacation - i will try my best to finish my tournaments 👍

Love you all 😍😍

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Clan: PIRATES

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# 14TheTower Aug 3 2019, 08:17 AM
QUOTE(Shanks @ Aug 3 2019, 06:54 AM) *


When it comes to what happened with the „patch“ ??
I guess Orange was clear enough as well as Pallando was when he realized that, this is not gonna be a good thing for the bfme community , he wanted to start over from 0 based on 1.06 and also Felixanius was for that and nearly everyone was against 1 shotted gates and op orcs ( so i hope you get my point that this isn’t only me )



Sure , this is why it's YOU , a "rotwk commentator" who deleted the patch of the website. You have no rights to do it and you know it

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# 15Val` Aug 3 2019, 11:54 AM
For now I will say that all this is under review and we will report back as soon as possible. So I ask that all the arguing be put on the backburners for a short while w00t.gif Thanks everyone


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# 16Beterwel Aug 3 2019, 12:04 PM
Stop arguing this. The split is real. 109 progresses with active players (a large part of the community) and events, with or without gamereplays. Once it is finished people will see the benefits and voluntarily choose to switch anyway. No conservatives will be able to stop these changes whatsoever. The best thing sceptics can do now is download the patch, play it and try to influence what way future changes will go:) you are all more than welcome to do so.

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# 17suturbs Aug 3 2019, 14:27 PM
QUOTE(Beterwel @ Aug 3 2019, 14:04 PM) *

Once it is finished people will see the benefits and voluntarily choose to switch anyway.

One thing I can say about this:


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# 18IlPrincipino Aug 3 2019, 17:17 PM
unsure.gif

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Clan: Sons of Elendil

Game: Battle for Middle Earth


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# 19Felixanius Aug 3 2019, 18:02 PM
QUOTE(IlPrincipino @ Aug 3 2019, 17:17 PM) *

unsure.gif


laugh.gif

Miss you Pino!


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Game: Battle for Middle Earth


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# 20IlPrincipino Aug 4 2019, 12:43 PM
biggrin.gif I just needed a break from the game to focus on other things, but I’ve been keeping an eye of what is happening here (I haven’t tried patch 1.09 yet). Anyway, I will play occasionally from now on I guess.

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