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The Asian Dynasties

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# 1Cookiecrisp13 Nov 21 2007, 17:41 PM
Japanese Onin Sohei Hammer
IPB Image IPB Image IPB Image
Welcome back to the newest installment of strategy, a little something I have been testing out in both team games and 1v1s. It is the Sohei allies Rush. Lets have a look:
Deck:
[JPEG, (152.00 KB)]


11 Sohei Allies IPB Image
A simple pikemen card it seems, for 500 gold. Too costly? Maybe. If used in the correct way, this card can absolutely shock your opponent. The stats:

ypNatSohei
Hitpoints: 140
Siege: 38
Attack: 13 (3.5 vs cav, 2.5 vs coyotes)
LOS: 12
Armor: 20% hand resist
Speed: 5
Cost from native: F-55, W-40 (45 gold from card)

These guys have some pretty nice siege. Lets compare that with a samurai:

ypKensei
Hitpoints: 230
Siege: 67
Attack: 25 (1.7 vs cav, 1.5 vs coyotes)
LOS: 16
Armor: 30% hand resist
Speed: 5
Cost: FĖ100 G-100

Those Sohei are 1/4th the cost of samurai, the Japís powerhouse sieger and fighter. Also they train pretty fast (or will once I hint you in on the SUPER SECRET way to get it faster)

The Consulate
IPB Image
This building here gives you several options all to great effect. Iím not too sure on the levels at which they are attainable.

Spain (lvl 40)- Spain is one of my favorite, one of my first choices early game. Why?
  • a slight xp trickle (.8 sec)
  • Merchant marine, which decreases the shipment time in half for all shipments (-50%)
Ports (lvl 0)- the bonus is a reduction in non-coin building costs (wood and food). This can lead to a faster age up at 640 food as well as a reduction in shrine cost to 108 wood.
  • Besterios are decent xbows for japs
  • Fishing boats for a better economy are always welcome
Isolation (lvl 0)- one to be reckoned with. Adds 10% attack (in all ways including siege) to your land units. A GREAT passive bonus indeed
  • Batch training in tens is great
  • a military rickshaw grants a stable or rax in need
Dutch (lvl 20)- a great economic faction, as the coin bonus is appreciated. Probably an afterthought after a failed or pushed back rush.
  • Bank is a great eco bonus
  • Church helps with LOS, Mercantalism, and unit train times
  • excellent military unit (6 stadhouders) even though you already have good musks ><
and there we have it, the consulate options for the Japanese!

One other item that is used here is the card Onin war, which increases the siege of all your units by a whopping 33%! Think of it as ransack for the Japanese.
IPB Image

okayÖ that was enough pre rambling, lets get on to the strategy:

IPB Image Discovery Age
  • Keep all vills on crates until fully gathered all wood and food. Build a shrine and after that set one villager onto building a consulate.
  • Set explorers to gather every food, gold, wood, and xp treasure you can (I mean all the small ones, and medium ones). Emphasize wood if you donít have enough for a consulate, after that look for gold and food.
  • send your first card, being Good Faith Agreements.
    IPB Image
  • Your age up should be with the Shrine, and set around six villagers on it. Age with around ten villagers or less.
    Why? Because the shrine will help your crap economy recover from the fast age up, as well as provide 20 population slots for military. The 200 export is also one of the main reasons for this wonder.
  • while aging gather 500 gold and just enough food (if you can) to keep up constant villager production.
  • be sure to ally with spain, and set the consulate to a hotkey which is easily accessible.
IPB Image Colonial Age
  • AS SOON AS YOU AGE UP select your hotkey and click the Merchant Marine (looks like the bottom of a ship going through water) upgrade. DO NOT SEND THE SOHEI YET! Wait until the upgrade is done, or it will have no effect on the shipment!
  • once you finish collecting gold, set half of your villagers on wood and half on food. Youíre looking to get a barracks out and on the field.
  • Your first shipment in colonial should be 11 Sohei
    IPB Image
  • With your next shipment, (should be soon, build some shrines or vills to get xp for it) ship Onin War
    IPB Image
  • Send your Sohei in to your enemyís TC to start sieging. Ally with isolation to allow your 10% additional siege take effect. Once onin war is in, your Sohei should have 50 siege!. Be carefull of minutemen- if you see them fall back and amass some yumi or ashigaru to compliment your army.
  • If you are rushing a native who has no minutemen or just hasnít called any out, be sure to micro your Sohei. When the town center fires at an unharmed Sohei, select it and put it in cover mode, which will make it last an additional two shots. Continue to do this until the tc is torn down.
  • Next shipment should be economy, like four villagers
    IPB Image
Thatís all I have for now, I hope you enjoyed it! Let me add a couple notes of my findings:

-This works best on maps that give you a bit of extra crates (obviously) such as deccan. The treasures there are great also.
- Ill have some recs up as soon as I can, been busy lately
-This has also worked for me and my buddy in a sling type fashion, to moderate success
-If used properly, you can take down the tc under six minutes

well, thanks for reading, now go take down some tcs, Yoi!

Card order:
Good Faith Agreements
11 Sohei
Onin war



This post has been edited by Cookiecrisp13: Nov 21 2007, 22:56 PM

Posts: 123

Game: Age of Empires 3


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# 2himynameismatt_ Nov 21 2007, 17:50 PM
Good job cookie smile.gif


I was looking at this card and strats to go with it in my early japanese training when i got the game, but i simply dismissed it due to the expense of 500 gold on your economy that early for 11 units that are somewhat useless in combat.


I'll try it out now. Who do you use this vs ?


I'd think a ff, but vs spain, dogs + rods would counter too easily..


I'll check it now, ty smile.gif

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Game: Call of Duty 4


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# 3DanaEileithyia Nov 21 2007, 19:45 PM
Nice Guide, pinned smile.gif.

Added to the Japanese Guide Index and the Asian Dynasties Guide index at the portal.

banana.gif

Please add some replays aswell!

Posts: 9,632

Game: Dawn of War 2


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# 4himynameismatt_ Nov 21 2007, 19:48 PM
just Tried vs a ff'ing Otto, and vs a ff'ing german... it didn't quite work, maybe i'm doing something a little wrong, i aged to II with 16 villagers, at about 4:20, and sent the Onin card immediately. It just wasn't enough with all of the waiting you have to do to get your Onin up to decent strength. By then the german had already fast-fastforted, and got 8 skirms out to kill my attack at about 7 20 when i was still trying tokill his buildings.


So idk, i'll keep trying smile.gif

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Game: Call of Duty 4


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# 5Cookiecrisp13 Nov 21 2007, 22:52 PM
QUOTE(MyxTragedy @ Nov 21 2007, 14:48 PM) *

just Tried vs a ff'ing Otto, and vs a ff'ing german... it didn't quite work, maybe i'm doing something a little wrong, i aged to II with 16 villagers, at about 4:20, and sent the Onin card immediately. It just wasn't enough with all of the waiting you have to do to get your Onin up to decent strength. By then the german had already fast-fastforted, and got 8 skirms out to kill my attack at about 7 20 when i was still trying tokill his buildings.
So idk, i'll keep trying smile.gif


i might have phrased it wrong. send the sohei first then onin war. ill add a card order and change the order i put the colonial build order in wacko.gif my bad

btw thnx for the pin!

Posts: 123

Game: Age of Empires 3


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# 6TheBengals3 Nov 22 2007, 03:40 AM
I've actually had this used agaisnt me before you posted the guide. It works really great against civs that tend to build forward because sometimes you can catch their rax before they get many units. Thats what happened to me. I was Chinese and I build a war academy forward and to my surprise about 10 muskets and 11 sohei came and took out my few units and my rax but i recovered and ended up winning. it was really surprising though. However if a civ builds back in their base and stays defensive its almost a guarenteed loss for you.

Posts: 301

Game: The Asian Dynasties


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# 7himynameismatt_ Nov 22 2007, 10:59 AM
Woops, i got my names mixed up. i sent the Sohei immediately, then Onin..


Idk, i must be doing it wrong somehow, but it seems the boost in siege doesn't come for a long time, and by the time you're attacking, a couple batches of units kill your rush.


The problem is with this, it's somewhat like a pike/courer rush, if it doesnt work, and even if it does, your economy is so dead that even with your opponent not making villagers out of their tc, they'll be above you in score.


Hmm, i'll try it more smile.gif


Also: Cookie, when're you online? Wouldn't mind getting some games in with you smile.gif

This post has been edited by MyxTragedy: Nov 22 2007, 11:01 AM

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Game: Call of Duty 4


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# 8King Rooney Nov 24 2007, 18:29 PM
amazazing...now i have to write a guide..........

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# 9DanaEileithyia Nov 28 2007, 20:27 PM
QUOTE(Coast Guard pro @ Nov 24 2007, 19:29 PM) *

amazazing...now i have to write a guide..........

Give it a try tongue.gif.

@Cookie still waiting for some pro replays smile.gif.

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Game: Dawn of War 2


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# 10himynameismatt_ Nov 29 2007, 11:11 AM
Mhm Cookie, i can't get this to work.


I don't know if i'm doing it wrong, or if i'm using it vs the wrong opponents, but it just isn't effective enough in 1v1, and when i tried it in team, some siege units won't do much when your economy is as destroyed as the person who's tc you downed, and their team-mates can just sling them up again.

You really need to post some recs of this working, else i'm gunna stop trying post-13661-1143531603.gif

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Game: Call of Duty 4


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# 11Cookiecrisp13 Nov 30 2007, 02:38 AM
QUOTE(himynameismatt_ @ Nov 29 2007, 06:11 AM) *

Mhm Cookie, i can't get this to work.
I don't know if i'm doing it wrong, or if i'm using it vs the wrong opponents, but it just isn't effective enough in 1v1, and when i tried it in team, some siege units won't do much when your economy is as destroyed as the person who's tc you downed, and their team-mates can just sling them up again.

You really need to post some recs of this working, else i'm gunna stop trying post-13661-1143531603.gif


You're all to right about it, Its VERY circumstantial, and very hard to get to work sad.gif

I do have 1 recording so i guess ill post it, but this has had its most use in 2v2s for me.

I need to rethink some of this as it does work rarely.

Posts: 123

Game: Age of Empires 3


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# 12VooDoo_BoSs Nov 30 2007, 02:54 AM
Nice strategy. How do they do vs Chinese Disciples? Got any times or records?

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Game: Battlefield 3


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# 13Thranduil Nov 30 2007, 03:26 AM
Doesn't really work for me either, maybe you should do a more ecowise version of this, and the sohey being more of a support to an ashi, yumi force or w/e/

Posts: 1,858

Game: The Asian Dynasties


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# 14himynameismatt_ Nov 30 2007, 15:33 PM
Tried 3 more times today. I'm not going to say: "This doesn't work", becuase maybe it does. I can't find any situation where this will work for me, and i'm just gunna stop wasting my time trying when it obviously can't work when i try it.

Get some recs to back it up at least, else there's no point people trying, when you say it barely works yourself post-13661-1143531603.gif


Just edit it around abit, it might work in a certain case, that you'll need to specify.

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Game: Call of Duty 4


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# 15Cookiecrisp13 Nov 30 2007, 22:24 PM
You're completely correct matt

the game i have here shows hwat its supposed to look like. I got it awhile back when i still had more faith in the strat. It does seem as if youl need the sohei as a complementary unit in your army. Yumi would seem to fit the gap.


Attached File(s)
Attached File JOSH.age3Yrec
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Number of downloads: 85
Player Name Side Team
[JudgĶ] CookieCrisp13 1
[ThLo] King_ofall_Kings 2

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Game: Age of Empires 3


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