Explore GameReplays...

Supreme Commander

[3251] Poita_ vs. TheBigOne

#1Poita_  May 22 2007, 16:02 PM -
Replays: 7 Game:
Awards:
This was a pretty short game but I think it highlighted a few key concepts that we will be seeing a lot of, especially from Cybran players in this new patch.

As I'm sure you are all aware of, Rhinos (as well as other tier 2 tanks) got a nice boost in this patch to promote more tier 2 play and they perform exceptionally well against tier 1 units now. TheBigOne has been playing fast tech 2 for quite a while now (even before the patch) with great success and he continues this trend by utilizing it in this game.

A few key points to note:

- The fast tech strategy works the same way it does in almost every RTS. In a nutshell, it is a sacrfice of early economy and map control to gain a tech advantage over your opponent.
- As you can see, while TheBigOne is teching up, I gain a significant economy advantage by taking one of the islands and a lot of the mainland mass points. I probably should've went for the other island sooner.
- Notice how TheBigOne sends his ACU out to collect mass points early on. The reason for this is because early game the ACU is virtually invincible so no amount of raiding can stop him getting mass points. It was unfortunate that his ACU ran into mine; I think he should've instead moved over to the otherside to try and gain more of the mass points on that side instead of sticking around.
- When facing a fast tech 2 you should try and spot the warning signs as soon as possible (I didn't). If you notice a significant lack of units and expansion on his part then you should try to get tech 2 as well straight away because you aren't going to win in tier 1.

I've been thinking about counters to this strategy. I think a fast drop would work very well, dropping units right next to his tech-up engies. It depends on the amount of AA he has though. I know TheBigOne usually spams a few Sky Slammers when doing his fast-T2 so it might not be as effective, although you could always drop some distance away and just run in. Fast-T2ers rarely have much ground forces so 6 mantis in their base early on could cause some real problems for him, especially if coupled with external raiding.

Anyway, enjoy watching. It's a very close ending. Expect to see a lot more fast tier 2 this patch! thumb.gif
This post has been edited by Poita_: May 22 2007, 16:03 PM
#2wolfman  May 22 2007, 19:05 PM -
Replays: 18
Holy crap that is nuts. I don't think it is possible for me to counter that fast tech strat. I can't think of any improvements for either player beyond those mentioned.
#3AncientSion  May 22 2007, 19:56 PM -
Replays: 16 Game:
Awards:
I was impressed as well. I believe he had 3 rhinos at minute 5, possibly 5:30. At first i thought they arent as good, because their lasers seem to miss a lot, but their range is very good and offsets that.

Anyways, cool game.
#4DreamcastJunkie  May 22 2007, 20:24 PM -
Replays: 5 Game:
Are we going to see a return to the days of nobody ever building T1 units now?
#5RDon  May 22 2007, 22:02 PM -
Replays: 23 Game:
QUOTE(DreamcastJunkie @ May 22 2007, 16:24 PM) *

Are we going to see a return to the days of nobody ever building T1 units now?


When did this ever happen?
#6Poita_  May 23 2007, 00:55 AM -
Replays: 7 Game:
Awards:
QUOTE
Holy crap that is nuts. I don't think it is possible for me to counter that fast tech strat. I can't think of any improvements for either player beyond those mentioned.


Spotting the signs of the fast tech is most important imo. How to go about countering it I'm not sure. Safest way is just to use your economy advantage to tech up ASAP like I did and fight back from there. You can also try to use your ACU as much as possible to hold back the rhinos.

I'm fairly confident that drops would really hurt this strat. He simply does not have time to build an air factory for interceptors and it's not hard to just drop out of the range of any stationary AA then run in and kill his tech up engineers. Or ever better: run in, kill his AA and bring in a T1 gunship to clear up. The strategy TheBigOne uses is very naked so early exploitation may be the best counter. Of course, you have to know whether or not he's doing it first. Scouting is key.
#7TrueTheReaper  May 23 2007, 14:36 PM -
Replays: 3
Awards:
UEF lobo drop kills T2 factories in about 2 volleys. Itīs the only "working" solution, most of the time i get rolled over by T2 tech
#8TNT  May 23 2007, 19:36 PM -
Replays: 16 Game:
QUOTE(Poita_ @ May 22 2007, 14:55 PM) *


Spotting the signs of the fast tech is most important imo. How to go about countering it I'm not sure. Safest way is just to use your economy advantage to tech up ASAP like I did and fight back from there. You can also try to use your ACU as much as possible to hold back the rhinos.

I'm fairly confident that drops would really hurt this strat. He simply does not have time to build an air factory for interceptors and it's not hard to just drop out of the range of any stationary AA then run in and kill his tech up engineers. Or ever better: run in, kill his AA and bring in a T1 gunship to clear up. The strategy TheBigOne uses is very naked so early exploitation may be the best counter. Of course, you have to know whether or not he's doing it first. Scouting is key.



A transport gunship would wipe out those engineers in 3 seconds and be able to whizz off and harass mass extractors that the sky slammers aren't guarding. I think i'm going to be trying that against t2 rushers in the future. An air factory would also be great for scouts to tell if he IS going fast t2.
This post has been edited by TNT: May 23 2007, 19:40 PM
#9Poita_  May 24 2007, 02:32 AM -
Replays: 7 Game:
Awards:
QUOTE
A transport gunship would wipe out those engineers in 3 seconds and be able to whizz off and harass mass extractors that the sky slammers aren't guarding. I think i'm going to be trying that against t2 rushers in the future. An air factory would also be great for scouts to tell if he IS going fast t2.


That would be the ideal situation. I'm just wondering if you'd be able to spot the fast tech in time to get a gunship out.

I can't remember what time TheBigOne hit tier 2 but I know it was before 5 minutes. If you went land, land, air, scout would you have enough time to quickly get a transport + 6 light bots out in time? Or would you have to go air fact second? Then that raises the question of whether or not you could fight a land, land, air build with a land, air, land build in case he isn't fast teching.

#10timmyfred  May 24 2007, 04:52 AM -
Replays: 11 Game:
Build a land scout and send it at him...that early in the game, regardless of what build he's using, you should be able to get one into his base to check stuff out without much problem
Reply to Comment