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Command and Conquer 4

AsafB vs GDI Defense Murderers

#1AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 13:25 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
I have decided to upload that very intense replay of a game I played yesterday against GDI Defense Murderers with Crystal Shields + 2 ION Cannons and a Mamoth tank GDI guy which was backed by many engineers provided by the GDI Defense guys in critical times.

1. The GDI Defense guys kept making Engineers + Zone Captains.
2. A GDI Offense guy was making Mamoth Tanks.
3. ION Cannon striked every minute maybe less due to the presense of 2 ION Cannon structures.
So you can guess living on the ground was not easy.
I promise you this game was decided in the last few seconds of the game in a difference of 11 points only.

To make things even more interesting, I did not have experienced enough NOD players on the NOD side. The lack of experience on the NOD side can be concluded by some factors such as one NOD Offense guy was spamming Raiders (with miniguns!) at tier 3.. while our enemies where pretty much Heavy Units and tough Zone Captains.
He could go Specters, or play more a macro strategy game if he has no confidence in being on the battle front and help keeping the nodes red.

I wish messages delivered in public and private chat would have been recorded as part of the game replay like in Star Craft II. This contributes a lot to reproduce the feelings that occurred during the battle.
You know, the most entertaining things that could happen DURING a BATTLE is a GDI opponent (Mamoth tank guy in this case) shouting at his allies in German on the public chat. It looks like Gibberish followed by lots of exclamation marks (!) at the end of the message..
One of his allies replied with a message of his own followed by twice the amount of exclamation marks.
If the messages would have been recorded, I would stream this game replay in YouTube and provide translation as subtitles like a movie. It could be kind of a comedy show.

I gave a try out by watching this game through several player eyes and I honestly can tell you that GDIs was all brute force power, nothing radical in their gameplay that makes it interesting to watch through their eys.

If you watch through their eyes you will see and hear mainly their unit quotes coming out of the crawler:
"Spartan at the ready,
Spartan at the ready..
Lancer ready for assignment,
Lancer ready for assignment,
Mamoth tank ready for battle,
Mamoth tank ready for battle,
Zone Captain sign in,
Zone Captain sign in.." and so on..

Pay attention to me applying ANTI EMP (Was so helpful against those GDI Defense Murderers), Healing Support Powers not just to heal, but also to generate crapes I can collect, HiJacking of vehicles, Bassilisk Stasis field to buy time and maybe even to save a heroic unit and Crawler location to help make a TCN Node red.
I strongly recommend you to watch through my eyes.
This post has been edited by AsafB: Jan 31 2011, 11:35 AM
#2Incia  Jan 28 2011, 17:14 PM -
Replays: 27 Game:
Awards:
It's the wall-of-text and 'LOOK AT ME I'M PRO ALL ELSE SUCK' that makes your replays a bit tame.
I'm now watching this because I had C&C 4 open and thought about wasting some time on replays.

So far this is what have happened early-game:

1 GDI Player disconnects.

chamlovesyou actually kills 2 units with a Crawler Decommission, then guards an Uplink with 2 Scorpions which a GDI army is trying to take + carrying a tib, the Scorpions do no real damage but they bought just enough time for chamlovesyou to respawn on top of the GDI army; killing them. Then also capturing the tib with a Scorpion tank.

1 Nod Player disconnects.

So this is a 4vs4 now.

So far chamlovesyou have been a very great player in this replay, however, nothing fancy from you early-game, hope you do better at tier 3 then.

Spoiler
oh lord those GDI Player pay no attention... orange just ran in with a hijacker spam and stole about 6-8 GDI tanks. facepalm. GDI please try to reverse move or decommission hijacked units.
Fun to watch though, I laughed out loud there.

One interesting point was to see zone captains totally own blackhands, blackhands are slow and can't really dodge the ion beam, seemed to take just 3-4 shots and a horde of blackhands were dead.
This post has been edited by Incia: Jan 28 2011, 17:30 PM
#3AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 17:34 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
QUOTE
It's the wall-of-text and 'LOOK AT ME I'M PRO ALL ELSE SUCK' that makes your replays a bit tame.
I'm now watching this because I had C&C 4 open and thought about wasting some time on replays.

So far this is what have happened early-game:

1 GDI Player disconnects.

chamlovesyou actually kills 2 units with a Crawler Decommission, then guards an Uplink with 2 Scorpions which a GDI army is trying to take + carrying a tib, the Scorpions do no real damage but they bought just enough time for chamlovesyou to respawn on top of the GDI army; killing them. Then also capturing the tib with a Scorpion tank.

1 Nod Player disconnects.

So this is a 4vs4 now.

So far chamlovesyou have been a very great player in this replay, however, nothing fancy from you early-game, hope you do better at tier 3 then.


1. I never said it was a 5 vs 5 all game. In fact your sayings only show you saw an early game part and stopped watching because you must be expecting something interesting too early maybe and got dissapointed.
2. It turns out a 3 vs 3 some time later.
3. I have not meant to say chamlovesyou is not good. By the way, he was the guy who was doing the raider spam in Tier 3 where GDIs where all pretty much heavy units. He could go stealth tanks or even specters.

You should watch it.. I would not have uploaded this replay If it was a standard NOD offensive game with a little micro like many other GDIs game.. it has a point in demonstrating good usage of special NOD abilities that not many NOD players use.
This post has been edited by AsafB: Jan 28 2011, 17:35 PM
#4Incia  Jan 28 2011, 17:45 PM -
Replays: 27 Game:
Awards:
Did I say I stopped watching? I said I only commented early-game. I'm STILL watching it. It's now on late-game.

And you didn't say it's 5vs5, usually if nothing is mentioned then it means it's a 5vs5. Just if there is many drops the uploader usually says that.
And at late-game this seems to be a 3vs4... it's just something worth to mention. Especially if someone is going to VOD this, it would take them by surprise when a 5vs5 game ends as 3vs4...

EDIT: And about those raiders, I see the point why he did it, 1 GDI Player ahd like 5000 Engineers, he tried to snipe them down. But yeah maybe a stealth specter army would have worked better.
This post has been edited by Incia: Jan 28 2011, 17:46 PM
#5AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 17:57 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
QUOTE
Did I say I stopped watching? I said I only commented early-game. I'm STILL watching it. It's now on late-game.

And you didn't say it's 5vs5, usually if nothing is mentioned then it means it's a 5vs5. Just if there is many drops the uploader usually says that.
And at late-game this seems to be a 3vs4... it's just something worth to mention. Especially if someone is going to VOD this, it would take them by surprise when a 5vs5 game ends as 3vs4...

EDIT: And about those raiders, I see the point why he did it, 1 GDI Player ahd like 5000 Engineers, he tried to snipe them down. But yeah maybe a stealth specter army would have worked better.


OK.. I am happy that your are more synchronized with the events now.
But one more thing regarding your statememnt about "nothing fancy" at early game and "chamslovesyou drops and kills 2 units".

By the time that happened I did ~218+ points by killings, almost 3 times more than chameslovesyou and it was with NOD tier 1 pure.
But doing fine in Tier 1 is not the reason I upload this. Again, as I mentioned before this introduces special NOD abilities that requires more than reversing a unit from time to time. It worth watching until the end.

Don't get me wrong.. I followed chameslovesyou.. and he knows how to control his units. I am convinced he is a good player. And I am happy that I played along his side. And yet there was not enough skill on the NOD team.
This post has been edited by AsafB: Jan 28 2011, 18:04 PM
#6Incia  Jan 28 2011, 18:03 PM -
Replays: 27 Game:
Awards:
luisman did pretty good with defense, kind of surprised, on ladder games everyone skips defense because they are 'UP'... but especially at Tier 3 defense gets a bit dangerous.

And this chaos could be a fun VOD matter of fact, I have a super computer but this replay at late-game lagged... there's almost 10 Mammoth Tanks in one screen at the end, Incinerator Turret spam, Zone captains and Ion Cannons, Basilisks, High Confessors.

If you want to be entertained then watch the late-game. And oh, yeah, this also ends with only 11VP difference... (I know which Player could have won the game, and got me super mad he made the stupid mistake >__> but won't spoil smile.gif )

Spoiler
If I would have to choose a Player to be disappointed at then I would probably pick oranges, he did something good early-game but, mid to late-game it looked like he was afk in spawn... only used his few hijacked units... hmm... post-13661-1143531603.gif


EDIT: I would edit the OP with a quick note "starts as 5vs5 but ends as 3vs3"... it's usually a point of interest when watching a Replay.
This post has been edited by Incia: Jan 28 2011, 18:08 PM
#7AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 18:09 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
QUOTE
luisman did pretty good with defense, kind of surprised, on ladder games everyone skips defense because they are 'UP'... but especially at Tier 3 defense gets a bit dangerous.

And this chaos could be a fun VOD matter of fact, I have a super computer but this replay at late-game lagged... there's almost 10 Mammoth Tanks in one screen at the end, Incinerator Turret spam, Zone captains and Ion Cannons, Basilisks, High Confessors.

If you want to be entertained then watch the late-game. And oh, yeah, this also ends with only 11VP difference... (I know which Player could have won the game, and got me super mad he made the stupid mistake >__> but won't spoil smile.gif )

Spoiler
If I would have to choose a Player to be disappointed at then I would probably pick oranges, he did something good early-game but, mid to late-game it looked like he was afk in spawn... only used his few hijacked units... hmm... post-13661-1143531603.gif


Incia, luisman indeed was helpfull with his NOD Defense gameplay, however, I am convinced that a very experienced NOD player would go a HEROIC RECKONER CONFIGURATION instead of just feeding the enemy with naked High Confessors.
I am happy to be along his side.
This post has been edited by Jack: Jan 30 2011, 02:19 AM
#8Incia  Jan 28 2011, 18:19 PM -
Replays: 27 Game:
Awards:
Not so sure if he 'feeded', seems he killed more with them then died. Problem with Reckoners is they cost alot of CP, you can't buy that much fire-power if you go all-in reckoner spam. And at this fight you needed all the firepower you could afford.

1 question though, the GDI Mammoth Tanks had Backup Systems, why didn't you kill the husks? There was one special case where you ignored about 6-7 Mammoth husks... they reborn with full HP and got a Crawler kill... could have been smart to wipe out the battlefield when there were so many husks...

PS: GDI didn't really use the crystal shields that good, I was hoping for a stasis field spam but I only saw 1 use of stasis field, you even at one point killed 3 crystal shields with a subterranean strike, that's 30VP instantly... with 1 use of stasis field they could have saved all that.
This post has been edited by Incia: Jan 28 2011, 18:21 PM
#9AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 18:56 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
QUOTE
Not so sure if he 'feeded', seems he killed more with them then died. Problem with Reckoners is they cost alot of CP, you can't buy that much fire-power if you go all-in reckoner spam. And at this fight you needed all the firepower you could afford.

1 question though, the GDI Mammoth Tanks had Backup Systems, why didn't you kill the husks? There was one special case where you ignored about 6-7 Mammoth husks... they reborn with full HP and got a Crawler kill... could have been smart to wipe out the battlefield when there were so many husks...

PS: GDI didn't really use the crystal shields that good, I was hoping for a stasis field spam but I only saw 1 use of stasis field, you even at one point killed 3 crystal shields with a subterranean strike, that's 30VP instantly... with 1 use of stasis field they could have saved all that.


Yes you are correct. There was a Mammoth Tank graveyard at the north at some point. I was paying attention to this, however I hoped I will manage to capture them soon enough (like many other captures I already made) before they will be restored and reactivated to the favor of the GDI side.
My time assessment was wrong and they got reactivated pretty fast. I did pay attention. But still, I failed to evaluate correctly their reactivation clock. Therefore, I should have destroyed those husks myself If I was not sure I can capture them soon enough.
It is not the only mistake. I did another mistake when I forgot to apply the SPECTRUM BEAM upgrade on the Bassilsks right away. I did apply that upgrade eventually but about ~3 minutes late.

The third mistake happened when I pulled the Mamoth Tank guy to chase me south-east (TCN Node 3, territory of the GDI blue tib), where I should have collected the naturally generated crapes on the map to fill the armor batteries of some good units I had there.
Again, regarding the crawler kill those reactivated Mamothes caused.. pay attention that I applied the CLOAKING FIELD (Tier 1 Support Power) on luisman75 which turned him stealthed during his attempt to escape the reactivated Mamoth Tanks.

He probably had no idea how come his crawler turned stealthed suddenly when packed.
I believe that if luisman75 got a Reckoner Configuration with healing abilities, he would have more survivability and could have managed to escape stealthed while the Recokners heals him even if he had no idea where his stealth abilities emerged.
When the NOD Defense crawler is packed and is on the move to attempt escape, It can't shoot so it is effectively equivalent as having the crawler on hold fire, a case where a Stealth Support power applied by an ally can help him escape unnoticed. It is a special case where CLOAKING FIELD can help your NOD DEFENSE ally escape.
Again I don't know him, I just had 20 Support points to spare for this and tried to help the man, but he was not able to complete that potential fancy escape.

I absolutely not agree about fire on the account of critical amount of healing power.
Today, my experience (from replays and from myself) shows that best players both on GDIs and on the NOD side will do way better than having no healing power at all. It applies to this very same replay as well. I do way better than my allies despite I employ less firepower to favor some critical healing power.

A tactic of making 8 Hunter tanks and delete a half beaten Hunter from time to time instead of healing is used by some players in early game (Cruilty does so), but those GDI murderers with so many Mamoth Tanks, Zone Captains, you must have survivability to endure this or you will just feed them even if you manage to do some damage, your troops will die and won't get heroic with no healing power.
This post has been edited by AsafB: Jan 28 2011, 19:08 PM
#10AsafB  Jan 28 2011, 19:59 PM -
Replays: 31 Game:
QUOTE

..So far chamlovesyou have been a very great player in this replay..


Oh.. no.. I just reviewed chamlovesoyou gameplay.. and unfortunately all I can see is so ineffective Scorpion spam (although he has a potential to become a great player.

I am amazed when he is trying to go on GDI Striker units with the Scorpion laser when the counter system gives him so-little cursor literally begging him not to do it simply because it is incorrect and ineffective.
He encounters many strikers south east (TCN Node 3, GDI blue tib territory) and keeps making more and more scorpion until he is exhausted and forced to retreat due to ineffectiveness, not target specific of his army. (He should have made some raiders and tanks instead)
In the first time he is overwhelmed and manage to re-drop on the uplink and make moderate damage to GDI units. But the guy just keeps making Scorpions against Strikers and Bulldogs, and ignores the counter-system's cursor which still begs him not do it.
He could use the second ability of the Scorpion to disable one or two Spartan Tanks but he doesn't.
He is forced to delete his crawler again and start from scratch at the NOD Deploy Zone far at the cold north.
He spams Scorpions again and this time he is trying to take on a GDI HEROIC FOCUS BEAM turret constructed by a nearby GDI Defense. Again, not effective and forced to retreat again.. He should go blast damage by making 2 Flame Tanks backed up by some tanks maybe but Scorpions are not the right weapon to any of his early scenarios.
No heavy units in early game. Scorpions are slow. They can't get tib to safety fast, Absolutely no reason to spam them and exhaust 60 CP on them. This makes him delete his crawler too late, losing it to a GDI Defense + 100 victory points for that unnecessary loss.
He can be a great player! But before that he must follow the counter system especially in early game.


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